Prop 8 Won’t Be on The Ballot in 2010

April 12, 2010 at 11:13 am 134 comments

by Brian Leubitz

Today, Love Honor Cherish, the leader of the Repeal Prop 8 2010 organization sent out a press release announcing that they had failed to get enough signatures on the ballot. (The full release is available in the full post.)

Love Honor Cherish, which spearheaded an effort to place an initiative on the November 2010 ballot to repeal Proposition 8 and restore equal marriage rights for same-sex couples, announced today that the proponents did not gather the 694,354 signatures necessary to place the proposed initiative on the ballot. The group vowed to work toward the repeal of Prop 8 at the next general election in November 2012.

“This is a heartbreaking moment,” said John Henning, Executive Director of Love Honor Cherish. “Despite the dogged efforts of hundreds of volunteers across California, we did not get the signatures we needed within the 150-day window set by the state.”

Under California law, it is too late to mount a new effort to repeal Prop 8 in 2010. “Regrettably, Prop 8 will remain as a stain on our constitution until at least 2012, and perhaps later,” said Henning. He challenged activists statewide to rededicate themselves and unify behind a 2012 repeal effort.

While this isn’t a surprise, it does end a trying divide within the LGBT community. I do not speak for the courage campaign or anybody other than myself here, but generally, I’m inclined to believe gubernatorial elections have a better electorate for our side. That is 2010 would have been better than 2008, and 2014 will be better than 2012. During off year elections, you get better educated electorates, and that correlates fairly well with those who aren’t really bothered by marriage equality. I have done some analysis looking at that, but also have spoken to a few huge voter number nerds who agree with that hypothesis. It’s still an open question, however.

That being said, time matters as well, probably even more than presidential or gubernatorial year. As more millenials spill into the voting ranks, more pro-equality votes are stacking up on our side. While 2 years won’t make a huge difference, many number nerds think it is just under 2 percent per year that the electorate moves toward equality. Obviously, that’s far from a precise number, but 4 percent would be enough to flip the Prop 8 vote around.

That being said, this time we would be running a Yes campaign, which is always more challenging. Given this news and the rumblings coming out of major LGBT organizations, it looks we are headed like a laser beam towards a 2012 confrontation for our marriage rights.

It’s a shame that Prop 8 still stands, and it is my sincere hope that Judge Walker and the federal courts strike it down. However, I am very cognizant of the fact that we are likely headed to the ballot. Get your door-knocking shoes all polished up, we have work to do.

All-Volunteer Petition Drive Triggered Conversations Across California
(LOS ANGELES – April 12, 2010)

Love Honor Cherish, which spearheaded an effort to place an initiative on the November 2010 ballot to repeal Proposition 8 and restore equal marriage rights for same-sex couples, announced today that the proponents did not gather the 694,354 signatures necessary to place the proposed initiative on the ballot. The group vowed to work toward the repeal of Prop 8 at the next general election in November 2012.

“This is a heartbreaking moment,” said John Henning, Executive Director of Love Honor Cherish. “Despite the dogged efforts of hundreds of volunteers across California, we did not get the signatures we needed within the 150-day window set by the state.”

Under California law, it is too late to mount a new effort to repeal Prop 8 in 2010. “Regrettably, Prop 8 will remain as a stain on our constitution until at least 2012, and perhaps later,” said Henning. He challenged activists statewide to rededicate themselves and unify behind a 2012 repeal effort.

Prop 8 passed by a margin of 52 to 48 percent. However, polls taken since the vote have shown that a majority of Californians now support the right of same-sex couples to marry, indicating that a new ballot proposition to repeal Prop 8 would be likely to pass in November 2010. In March, a poll by the Public Policy Institute of California showed a 6 percent increase in support for equal marriage rights in just the last year.

The proponents of the repeal initiative sought to seize the momentum unleashed by the passage of Prop 8 and parlay it into a victory at the polls. “This signature campaign was the right thing to do in the wake of Prop 8,” said Love Honor Cherish board member Lester Aponte. “We were determined to act affirmatively to achieve equality and we will continue to do that until Prop 8 has been finally repealed. We had hundreds of thousands of conversations with California voters about the right to marry and we know that we have moved hearts and minds. In the process, we have set the foundation for a future repeal effort and brought hope to thousands whose hearts were broken by the passage of Prop 8.”

Love Honor Cherish was one of more than 40 groups supporting the repeal of Prop 8 in November 2010, and was part of the Restore Equality 2010 coalition. The campaign utilized a unique web-based social networking tool, located at, which enabled volunteers to download the petition form, watch training videos and join teams.

Entry filed under: Uncategorized.

On the Death of the Polish President Importance

134 Comments Add your own

  • 1. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 12, 2010 at 11:19 am

    Yes, but anything can happen. And with the news that Hillary Rodham Clinton has been mentioned as a possible nominee to replace Judge Stevens, we may have hope with the Supremes as well. Let us never give up, folks.

  • 4. Straight Ally #3008  |  April 12, 2010 at 11:51 am

    It’s cold comfort, but don’t forget that public opinion is steadily shifting toward marriage equality. This data set has been a decent predictor; Maine wasn’t quite there yet, for example, and California was a toss-up at best. There might also be a few more states in our column by then, too.

  • 5. Andrea  |  April 12, 2010 at 12:05 pm

    It’s a shame that Prop 8 still stands, and it is my sincere hope that Judge Walker and the federal courts strike it down.

    It is my sincere hope that EQCA and ACLU drop this appeals nonsense at once and comply with the Court’s orders so Judge Walker can do exactly that.

    Failing that, it is my sincere hope that there is a reliable ally inside the No-on-8 axis who will just dump the demanded documents onto WikiLeaks already so Cooper can get them from there and we can move forward with the case at hand.

    Failing that, I will conclude that EQCA and NOM are colluding to keep Prop 8 on the books forever by delaying this case and using it to short-circuit ballot repeals.

    • 6. Brian Leubitz  |  April 13, 2010 at 9:52 am

      Litigation is never quick, we need to have patience on this stuff. Nobody ever should have expected this case to be resolved over the course of a few months. This is going to take years to be resolved.

  • 7. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    I give up…LOL

  • 8. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    This is flat out a direct result of asshole Joe Solmonese at the HRC..who adamantly proclaimed that all the gays should shut up and wait for Obama to do something..which by the way JOE..he hasn’t…he WON’T.
    Thank you Joe and thank you HRC for setting our movement back with the sole purpose of prolonging equality so that you could try to convince more people to keep sending you their hard earned money for doing absolutely NOTHING for us.
    How are those fancy dinner parties going JOE?…win any wards THIS week JOE?
    How proud you must be.


    The sad part is that if we had gained enough signatures anyways…sudden;y JOE would have JUMPED into the fray….just like he did with the California prop 8 case.
    Joe is a disgusting pig.
    tell me…is it a hate crime when one gay guy beats the shit out of another?…just wondering.

    • 9. JeffSD  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:14 pm

      Violence is never the answer and implying it on a very public board, joking or not, puts a very bad face on our whole community.

      • 10. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:28 pm

        first of all Jeff..I did not imply violence. I asked a question.
        Secondly..nothing I could do or say would ever put a worse face on the gay community than the HRC has already done.

        Joe has ensured himself another 2 years of his 350,000 dollar a year salary.
        why I bet at the very moment they announced we didn’t gather enough signatures, he was already in his limo on the way to go shopping on Rodeo drive.
        and buying a another 3,000 suit for his next big dinner party with Kathy Griffin at his side. Both of them attention whores.

    • 11. Bolt  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:35 pm

      Why is the ninth circuit taking so long? Our liberties are on hold, we’re not getting any younger, and it gets more and more expensive to live everyday. We deserve an immediate injunction against proposition 8, and resume our practice of marriage equality!

      • 12. Andrea  |  April 12, 2010 at 2:02 pm

        The 9th is taking so long because EQCA and ACLU keep filing frivolous appeals, to prevent Judge Walker from ruling, so the damage you describe can continue for as long as possible.

        Now that the 2010 repeal possibility is gone, they’ve started pre-selling “Not in 2012 either.”

        Make of that what you will.

      • 13. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 2:05 pm

        Dear clueless andrea. These are NOT frivolous lawsuit being filed.
        perhaps you should pay attention to the facts….

        is your real name Melissa by any chance?. just curious.

      • 14. Andrea  |  April 12, 2010 at 2:21 pm

        Deiter, I’m the same Andrea who stood up for you when you made a possibly-racist comment about Justice Thomas back during the trial.

        However, if deciding I’m Melissa or George or Kay or whatever straw-man you feel like lashing out at today and flaming me makes you feel better, do whatever you think you have to.

      • 15. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 2:33 pm

        Andrea..your comment that these are frivolous lawsuits is just plain uninformed. period.
        just because you got your panties in a bunch and are restless…does not mean that our side should lay down and ignore facts. and the facts are that the documents asked for by the other side are in fact irrelevant to this case. Period. they are doing their jobs. and doing it well.
        if you are so impatient that you would rather our side ignore their duty..then I suggest you find a hobby until the case is ready to be decided. I am not willing to risk anything because you are just a whiny impatient person. let the people who know what they are doing do their jobs. a legal scholar you are not.
        there is NOTHING frivolous about these appeals.

      • 16. Monty  |  April 12, 2010 at 3:35 pm

        The “frivolous” appeals are dealing with free speech issues that I would argue are just as important as marriage equality. An extra couple of months of waiting are a small price to pay.

      • 17. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 3:53 pm

        But…But…Monty….Andrea does not want to wait for a silly little thing like freedom of speech issues..she wants a ruling right now….so everything else is frivolous….LOL

    • 18. Carvel  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:58 pm

      The problem is that as gay people we disagree on what needs to be done. I do not understand the reasoning of the people who keep putting off equality of marriage, equality of civil rights and employment. If the Blacks kept putting it off they still would not have their rights.

      It appears that Oboama and all the politicians that we are expecting to come to our aid simply will not come to help us. they give us lip service and that along with a million dollars might get you an advertisement on TV, but not in a good market and not at prime time.

      Who are we kidding. We have the same problems that the straight community has with politics. We have people who are more concerned with gathering their power base and using their influence to get more power than in actually doing something worthwhile.

      Why should gay rights be any different from any other political struggle. the people we hire to help us just collect the money and give us token results. I can underatand losing at the ballot box, but I can’t understand us not trying and other gay organizations not coming to our aid.

      It is sad that we are putting all of our eggs into one basket and hoping for the best. They need to turn over the information and move on with the case. What do we really have to hide. It simply does not make sense.

      • 19. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 5:04 pm

        Carvel..I am sure that in YOUR life you have nothing to hide right?…so you wouldn’t mind at all if we all came over to your house and went through it right?…I mean if you have nothing to hide you shouldn;t mind us doing that…Oh wait….you are entitled to privacy.

        just because we may not have anything to hide does not mean we should ignore law and legal precedents just to speed up a case. that would set a HORRIBLE precedent for future cases….
        It makes PERFECT sense to fight this and show once again how the rights of gays are being trampled by the courts who seem to enjoy ignoring the freedom of speech aspect.
        this appeal is more than just about our case.
        the articles they are requesting are irrelevant to this case, and if we just roll over and give in then we have NO hope of ever fighting this issue when it comes up again..the court can just say well “last time” you handed the irrelevant documents over….

      • 20. Kathleen  |  April 12, 2010 at 5:26 pm

        I don’t think this is a frivolous appeal at all. The D-Is are asking for documents from non-parties to the suit — parties who were involved in a political campaign. No matter how this eventually plays out, I think the First Amendment principles at stake are worth fighting over and I’m glad the ACLU and EQ CA are appealing. I know everyone is eager to get things moving, but in the grand scheme of things, I don’t think a few months delay is hugely significant in what is going to be a multi-year legal process.

      • 21. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 5:29 pm

        Yes! Kathleen I agree.
        Just because we are getting eager for a verdict…doesn’t mean we shouldn’t fight for our other rights in the mean time.
        this issue affects future cases as well.

      • 22. Andrea  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:02 pm

        if we just roll over and give in then we have NO hope of ever fighting this issue when it comes up again..the court can just say well “last time” you handed the irrelevant documents over…

        They can post the documents publicly on their websites for all to see (or leak them), set no precedent at all, and ACLU will still be able to bring the First Amendment issue later, in a more morally-appropriate case. That would be one in which millions of people aren’t having their civil rights infringed, with daily “irreparable harm” and all that, for years on end while it plays out.

        This case is not the venue for it. Period.

      • 23. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:20 pm

        so andrea..because you are impatient to get your little verdict in as fast as possible…your thought process is that we should not bother fighting for our rights, and instead just “leak” some documents so we can hurry up and get a verdict?… do understand do you not that after Walkers ruling we still will be waiting YEARS for this to get all the way through SCOTUS?

        but you would rather us forget about our rights, to save a few days?…wow…just wow.

      • 24. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:21 pm

        and it is very telling where you say to wait for a “more morally appropriate case”

        there is NOTHING morally inappropriate about this case!

    • 25. Isha  |  April 13, 2010 at 10:55 am

      I think so. but go for it anyways.

  • 26. fern  |  April 12, 2010 at 12:54 pm

    sorry about 2010 I think you guys lack a charismatic leader to get you all united in one front and go for it.

    • 27. fiona64  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:12 pm

      Fern, there is a lot of truth in what you say. No Harvey Milk or Cesar Chavez has emerged for this movement. Sad but true.


      • 28. Marius  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:28 pm

        I think some of the problem is that there are too many organisations, and they are all just working for their cause, so insted of having on big one gathering all there are all these organisations fighting among themself for suport, seperating everyone, and not gething anywhere=(


      • 29. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:31 pm

        And we need to start eliminating some of them starting with the HRC

      • 30. Joel  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:35 pm

        Maybe Constance will be motivated to put a face and a voice to the cause?

      • 31. fern  |  April 13, 2010 at 10:55 pm

        Dear Fiona

        Once in a forum I said something about gay pride parades, that they were not the best to advance the cause, and oh man! they wanted to scratch my eyes out. To no avail I tried to explain why and that it was about perception and on how the media report it.
        Within the month in a speech Cleve Jones said more or less what I had written in a

      • 32. fern  |  April 13, 2010 at 11:36 pm

        “trying again”…
        Dear Fiona

        Once in a forum I said something about gay pride parades, that they were not the best to advance the cause, and oh man! they wanted to scratch my eyes out. To no avail I tried to explain why and that it was about perception and on how the media report it.
        Within the month in a speech Cleve Jones said more or less what I had written in my comment.

        So what about him????

        Also my point is “know thine enemy” and having been brought up in a white trash environment, sent to reform school and worked construction at 14. I should know how they perceive gay people and this is where I think I can help.
        Being 62 soon I feel a bit out of it but I’m sure I could have convinced bikers to vote no on 8.
        So again what about Cleve Jones I like him.

  • 33. GAYGUY  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:33 pm

    I did not even know they were trying to get signatures…I have been in the Castro, WeHo and Hillcrest areas of the major cities and have not even seen a banner/poster or a person asking for my signature. How can they get enough if they don’t hit three major cities’ heavily gay populated areas!

    • 34. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:41 pm

      I live in Sacramento and I got 4 emails a week telling me where they were meeting each day in WEHO to get signatures….
      they gathered signatures every other day down there..and NEVER up here.

      and the whole time Joe at HRC told his peeps NOT to participate or sign, because he does NOT want equality yet…he wants to remodel his home, and can’t do it if gays get equal rights. he needs to put off equality until people finally figure out they need to stop sending Joe their money.

    • 35. Kathleen  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:46 pm

      I wonder how successful we would have been in 2010 anyway. It seems that the passage of the health care bill has galvanized the extreme right in a way that will guarantee every wingnut out there will be at the polls this year. I realize we may not be as seriously impacted in California as in some states, but I fear this year is going to see a real swing to the right in who shows up at the polls.

      • 36. K!r!lleXXI  |  April 12, 2010 at 3:53 pm

        Exactly, Kathleen, after the Health Care reform the society is too agitated to make this decision in our favor.

      • 37. Monty  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:01 pm

        On the other hand, the marijuana legalization issue should bring out more young people, so it could balance somewhat.

      • 38. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:05 pm

        but unfortunately they will be so high they wont know what they are voting for.

      • 39. fern  |  April 14, 2010 at 12:16 am

        I would have tried anyway because that’s who I am and so what if it didn’t work at least I would have known it didn’t work and use a sharper knife in the next round, I would throw trash at them just like they do to you. I would have gone after Mike Colson which (not whom) I called “a crook for Nixon, now a crook for God”.
        1. the real enemy is not the sheeple you call bigots,
        they may be so but they only follow leaders. You have
        to dump trash on their leaders, find or invent trash on
        Maggie go after Larry Craig he chose the wrong side.

        2. I perceive you as a whining bunch, when these
        leaders say that gay people are pedophiles, you
        politely explain to them that scientist bla bla…
        When you should ask them about father Murphy with
        his anti-gay track record and belonging to an anti-gay
        outfit, question the strong family stand of honorable
        people like Ensign (the republicans want him out
        because they’re scared for their wives) and what’s his
        name in South Carolina.

        When you fight you fight dirty, the only rule is to win, a fight where the rules are obeyed is not a fight, it’s a convention or a Solomonella fishing party.

        I hope not to hurt anybody here but this is the way I see things.

  • 40. aaron  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    i had no idea signatures were being sought, and i live in san francisco.

  • 41. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:48 pm

    Coming soon to a thater near you. Looks good!

    and by the way, if you want to know about gay happenings and is up to YOU to visit websites and sign up for email notifications.

    these places don’t go out to gay bars to tell people whats up. You need to do the work to find out.

  • 42. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 1:58 pm

    The White House on Monday afternoon squashed growing speculation that President Barack Obama might nominate Secretary of State Hillary Clinton to fill the Supreme Court vacancy created by the retirement of Justice John Paul Stevens.

  • 43. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 2:51 pm

    Barney’s advice:

  • 44. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 2:54 pm

    PROOF Obama sold us out, and has ZERO intention of doing anything.
    and HRC is right by his side.

  • 45. Max  |  April 12, 2010 at 3:26 pm

    This is a GOOD thing. If we strike prop 8 down before the supreme court does, it is only struck down in california. If we wait to see what the SCOTUS does, then we can proceed from there. There is more at stake here.

    • 46. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:00 pm

      Will this still be a good thing when we lose at SCOTUS?

      The scotus will NOT vote in our favor.
      They just ruled that democracy no longer exists, and that
      Chevron is now in control of this nation. One of the most anti-gay corporations in history.

      They will NEVER vote against their new leader..the oil, banking, and healthcare industries. NEVER!

      • 47. Monty  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:03 pm

        Be nice. Corporations are people too, you know.

        Wait. No, they’re not.

      • 48. Max  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:33 pm

        If we fail then we just go back to the state-wide effort. Nothing new. If we win, we win for good. This way, we throw in the possibility of winning for good. Chances are Justice Kennedy will be the tie breaker, and he has always supported LGBT people at the court level.

        And Scalia said that there is now no constitutional basis to deny gays rights because lawrence v texas set the precedent that there is no reason to discriminate based on gender or sexual orientation. SCALIA said that.

      • 49. Max  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:55 pm

        And also I don’t think that SSM threatens the interests of big business.

  • 50. Michelle Evans  |  April 12, 2010 at 3:43 pm

    Back from vacation, so thought I’d throw in my 0.02. HRC is certainly to blame for this loss, but you must also lay blame at the feet of all the other major organizations that wanted to put our rights on hold for AT LEAST another two years. Every single major national LGBT organization said no to 2010, and thus would not support the efforts to get this on the ballot. Spread the blame to all of those in need of it.

    • 51. K!r!lleXXI  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:37 pm

      Do you think people would vote differently?
      That’s the bigger question now, and we seem to forget about it…
      Somehow, after everything I’ve seen this past year, I’m not sure people would vote in out favor. JMHGO (where’s Ronnie, btw?)

      P.S. Dieter… I wanted to thank you for going to some Nazi guy’s profile on YouTube 4 days ago… He went to your profile and there found mine… and he couldn’t restrain himself from saying some “nice” things about me being very clever to blur my picture because otherwise I would be killed by the skinheads in a heartbeat… “Nice” to read these things in the morning… really makes my day…

      • 52. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:41 pm

        Wow so now you are telling me who I can visit on youtube form MY own page…wow…just take yourself off my friends list. Problem solved. I don’t tell YOU whos page you can look at…blame the guy who said those things NOT me.

      • 53. K!r!lleXXI  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:52 pm

        Dieter, I don’t like how you read my messages lately.
        I didn’t tell you to do anything. Chill out, man.

      • 54. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:52 pm

        I took you completely off my youtube page so you don’t have to worry about what I do with my own page anymore. Hope that makes your life better!

      • 55. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:54 pm

        sorry that you do not also like how I read your messages…I only understand English, and what you said about my youtube page was clear. but like I said, I took care of that for you.
        No problem.!!

      • 56. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:56 pm

        and just so you know..your statement BITCHING about what I do and did on my own personal youtube page and posting it HERE for everyone to read in this forum that is non related was no better than what that “nazi” guy did to you. thanks alot!

      • 57. K!r!lleXXI  |  April 12, 2010 at 5:04 pm

        Well, I feel like it is related… such attacks from Nazis on us, especially initiated by our own people going to their profiles and writing hateful things (not that they do not deserve that) — that’s always something to discuss in this community. And I’m not the one who’s bitching here all the time, mind you.

      • 58. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 5:08 pm

        you came into a forum where I am a part, and posted PERSONAL information about something I did on a site that is MY own personal site. you had no right, and now you can never do it again. I made sure of that. perhaps you wouldn’t mind if I went all over the web and posted what YOU do on youtube….
        and fuck you…saying that mans attack on you was initiated by me. I don’t control what OTHER people do. Fuck you indeed.

      • 59. K!r!lleXXI  |  April 12, 2010 at 5:16 pm

        Things that you post on someone else’s YouTube channels (in comments section) are not personal — I could read them easily, like anybody else. So there is nothing personal about them. I never said anything from our personal messages. That cancer of yours does not give you the right to be such a bitch. So, go fuck yourself, OK?

      • 60. GAYGUY  |  April 13, 2010 at 4:00 pm

        I DO beleive we had a better chance if we got it on the ballot in 2010. I know people that thought they were voting YES for gay marriage….we could have put it on the ballot so that there was NO CONFUSION. I knew when I voted that NO was how I was gonna go, but the proposal was worded funny!!

    • 61. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 5:20 pm

      ANYTHING that I do not put in here MYSELF is personal you ugly f*ckin Russian trash.
      perhaps I will go post your “unblurred” picture all over Russian websites along with a link to YOUR youtube page…you would be OK with that right?….
      then all the skinhead Russians can come find ya!
      you wouldn’t mind right..because NOTHING is personal on youtube right?
      OK good..that’s what I will do. since I have your ugly unblurred face pic that you sent me in email then it is not private anymore. Thats what YOU said,
      so please say hello to all your new Russian friends..cuz I am about to go tell everyone about YOU and your youtube crap.
      have a lovely day!

      • 62. Papa Foma  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:13 am

        Neo-Nazi Revenge Killing of Russian Judge

        I hope you do not and can not actually post on Russian websites. What you are making here is a real and actual death threat to Kirill. As you can read in the above article, said pro-Nazi individuals do not fear to kill whom they please. Some of this started because you received a death threat and now you are making one of your own? I fear you are seriously crossing a line. Please do not get one of our own killed regardless of his nationality! Very concerned, Papa Foma

  • 63. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:33 pm

    Dear God:
    Last year you took my favorite actor Patrick Swayzee
    My favorite actress Farrah Fawcett
    My favorite musician Michael Jackson
    My favorite salesman Billy Mays…….

    I just wanted to let you know that my FAVORITE
    activist is Maggie Gallagher.
    Thank you in advance,

    • 64. GAYGUY  |  April 13, 2010 at 4:01 pm


  • 65. Bob  |  April 12, 2010 at 4:42 pm

    yes where is Ronnie, I miss him, and welcome back Michelle

  • 66. Sagesse  |  April 12, 2010 at 5:19 pm

    Another perspective.

    Each ballot initiative requires a campaign and money. The anti forces have institutional, reliable sources. If the 2010 initiative had gotten the required signatures, and had failed again, that would be less money available for 2012, or whatever comes up in the meantime. By 2012, the demographics and other progress (perhaps ENDA, perhaps DADT) will have moved in the right direction, and the Prop 8 court case will have advanced, but probably not be decided.

    An argument perhaps for keeping some powder dry.

  • 67. Ray in MA  |  April 12, 2010 at 6:38 pm

    Deeter an Krill:

    You’ve both made yousrelves look like idiots here.

    No need to spew that garbage here.

    Excuse yourselves and both leave with what dignity you have left.

    … with that behavior, it’s no wonder why there are wars in this world. Where two people can’t even handle their differences with civility, nevermind entire nations!

    • 68. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 6:45 pm

      Well sorry you feel that way, however I do not take kindly to someone posting personal information about me from another site into this site where others with whom I have no association can read them…
      It was uncalled for, unnecessary, unethical, and cowardly.

      and I wouldn’t exactly blame the world’s problems on my anger at this having happened. That was a bit dramatic dontcha think?…
      so don’t go worrying your cold little heart over me or my dignity. I have plenty.

      because unlike many in here..I don’t roll over and play dead when attacked. I bite back. Don’t like it?…don’t read my posts. I am usually not only quite civil in here, but I spend many hours posting information and such to help others.

      However..posting personal info about me on here, that was obtained from another website that is my personal unacceptable.
      now you have a lovely day.

      • 69. Ray in MA  |  April 12, 2010 at 6:59 pm

        There you go again!

      • 70. Ray in MA  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:04 pm

        But I do see your point… I’d be totally humiliated if everyone found out I was seeking and making friends with Nazi’s on Facebook!

      • 71. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:15 pm

        well there ya go. You just proved my point a**hole. what Krill did not mention was the fact that the “nazi’s” page I visited was a jerk who posted anti-gay stuff on my page, and I went to HIS page to respond. so fuck you too. and THAT is exactly why Krill’s action were reprehensible.
        but ignorant mofos like you don’t ever care about facts now do you?.

        perhaps if the commie KRILL had not “forgotten” to mention my purpose of the visit to the jerks page, I may not have been so upset, but you don’t care about facts…at all.
        the only NAZI here is YOU…who sees nothing wrong with others posting misleading personal information about others in here.
        don’t worry your time will come.

      • 72. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:15 pm

        and again since facts elude was youtube…

      • 73. Ray in MA  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:24 pm

        Well, like Ricky always said “Lucy, you’ve got some splainin’ to do”.

        You should have done that first before you showed your fangs.

      • 74. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:28 pm

        ray..I should never have been put in the position to have to do that in the first place. do you not understand my anger in that?..If not I cannot explain it. it never should have been posted.

      • 75. Ray in MA  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:42 pm

        I understand your anger.

        Could Krill have been so scared by the incident that he didn’t realize the implications of what he said? I’d give someone who received those kind of threats the benefit of the doubt. That would shake me up pretty bad!

      • 76. Ray in MA  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:44 pm

        We’re actually seeing a ‘cyber’ hate crime here. He was violated. Again, I would be in shock if something like that happened to me.

      • 77. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:49 pm

        and yet he “forgot” to mention in his first post that the reason I went to the Nazi’s page to begin with is to respond to a death threat that I received.
        only difference is that I am not afraid of anyone online. at all.
        scared or not…I just don’t think it was approproate.

        what if I said to everyone in here that I walked in on Ray on a bed with a naked little boy?..

        and forgot to put the part where you were just changing your son’s diaper?

        first it is no ones business second it would have been inappropriate.
        I am over it.
        perhaps a lesson was learned. He can’t do it again because I blocked him and removed him from my page.

        now can this all be done with?
        it’s tiring!!
        there is other news to worry about.

  • 78. Papa Foma  |  April 12, 2010 at 6:59 pm

    Don’t keep going negative (Dieter36 and others). You’ve got to remember that we’re dealing with politics and politicians. That means everything is based on “you scratch my back, and I’ll scratch yours.” Just as we have to pick our battles wisely, so do the legislators and the administration. Sequence is everything when obtaining rights. No one likes to lose . Reflect on what happened with the structuring of the health reform bill. That bill only made it by strategy. And despite some flaws, there will be a law to serve as a basis for a better system.
    I don’t think we should be disheartened by the sluggishness of the system. I’m certainly pleased with the results of the P-eight trial to date, and especially happy for this site (which would hot have existed without the trial)!!

    • 79. TPAKyle  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:50 pm

      Time for a little video break to put it all into perspective.

      • 80. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 7:52 pm



  • 81. Billy  |  April 12, 2010 at 8:48 pm

    Everyone, please feel free to troll American rednecks with me in voting “Kyle’s Pride” as the official toyota car. You’ll find the link below. Together, we can get awareness out there :D

    • 82. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 9:05 pm

      I voted, and then posted this to my facebook page where there are many many people….lol

  • 83. Dieter  |  April 12, 2010 at 10:36 pm

    GOP Losing Grip on Military

    By Neal Broverman

    More bad news for the Republican Party — a new survey finds the GOP is losing its hold on military service members.

    The Huffington Post reports a new Military Times survey, which questioned 1,800 troops, was released Monday. It found there’s been a one-third drop since 2004 in the number of service members who identify as Republican — from 60% to 41%. A nine-percentage-point drop occurred just in the last year.

    • 84. Straight Ally #3008  |  April 13, 2010 at 7:55 am

      This is incredibly good news, not because of the loss in self-identified Republicans (although for some that is certainly good news enough), but because it indicates that the Religious Right – who for years has mounted a terrifying campaign to take over the armed forces, especially the Air Force – is losing its influence. Hallelujah!

      • 85. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 13, 2010 at 8:04 am

        I can believe it. I live in the Fort Bragg area of North Carolina, and during the congressional hearings on DADT, they went to one of the locaL eateries near the base, and 98% of the people they talked to were in favor of LGBTQQI’s being able to serve openly. Remember, this is in the town that the 82nd Airborne calls home! So yes, the radicals who are hiding behind religion are losing their hold on our military, because our men and women in the military are smart enough to think for themselves on a lot of things.

      • 86. Straight Ally #3008  |  April 13, 2010 at 4:59 pm

        Music to my ears, Richard, thank you!

      • 87. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:24 pm

        And also to mine. I am a veteran of the US Navy, my first husband, may he rest in peace, was a USMC vet wtih tours in-country during vietnam, and BZ is a Vietnam Veteran of the USAF, also with time in-country. This just goes to prove that Gen. Mixon was NOT speaking for all of us when he wrote that shameful letter to Stars and Stripes.

      • 88. Straight Ally #3008  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:38 pm

        Richard, I can’t thank you and your loved ones enough for your service. Proud to be on your side!

      • 89. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:42 pm

        And I am honored to know you and your family through your posts here. How are your son and son-in-law, and your daughter and daughter-in-law?

      • 90. Straight Ally #3008  |  April 14, 2010 at 7:24 pm

        Richard, I have no children, but my family is doing well, thanks. :)

      • 91. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 15, 2010 at 8:07 am

        My goof. You just seem to care so much about us that it is like you are a parent to us. I am so glad that everybody in your family is doing well. And I am going to try and find the link to the preview I saw for next week’s Glee episode for all the Gleeks here and all our Madonna fans. The cheerleading coach nailed “Vogue.” And like everybody else here, I am so glad to see Ronnie back!

  • 92. Susan  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:50 am

    I have been looking for a petition to sign for months to get same sex marriage back on the ballot. I saw stacks of petitions everywhere but never same sex marriage. This is disappointing and I hope it makes it to the 2012 ballot. I’m so sorry to hear this news. But oh yes, leaglizing pot makes it. What kind of world are we living in?

    • 93. Straight Ally #3008  |  April 13, 2010 at 7:52 am

      Susan, legalizing medical marijuana was put on the ballot in Maine and passed. What kind of a world, indeed!

  • 94. Rose W.  |  April 13, 2010 at 8:07 am

    I never heard a peep about gathering signatures, and I’m at San Jose State University. If they weren’t trying to collect from the universities, what were their planners thinking?

  • 95. Bob  |  April 13, 2010 at 9:41 am

    So making the ballot for 2010, is a no go, that frees up some energy and resources, to focus everything on DADT, no sense looking back and wondering what went wrong, seems there was a division about persuing the ballot, as opposed to using the courts. That decision has been clarified, we made really good progress in the court case, now while we’re waiting, let’s pick one thing to focus our energy on. DADT

  • 96. Isha  |  April 13, 2010 at 10:51 am

    I guess my girlfriend and I will not be going to California any time soon. This suck who knows by then Cali would have had already broken off and sank into the ocean. we really wanted to go, but o well, I wouldn’t want to be in a hateful environment anyways .

  • 97. Kathleen  |  April 13, 2010 at 1:06 pm

    9th Circuit has denied the ACLU/EQCA appeal of the discovery order. Though there were a number of legal arguments addressed, in simple terms, the Court held that they do not have jurisdiction and does not have sufficient cause to intercede at this point in the case.

    Walker issued the following order:
    On March 22, 2010, the court ordered proponents not later than April 12, 2010 to “make the appropriate motion or submission” to supplement the trial record with documents obtained through third party production. Doc #623 at 24. The Ninth Circuit stayed the court’s order “pending appeal.” Doc #6 in 10-15649 (9th Cir March 26, 2010). The appeal was dismissed on April 12, 2010 at 5 PM PDT. Id Doc #14.

    Proponents have made no submission or motion to supplement the trial record. Accordingly, proponents are ORDERED to SHOW CAUSE in writing not later than April 16, 2010 at 5 PM PDT why the evidentiary record should not now be closed. Failure to respond to this order shall be deemed grounds to close the evidentiary record.

    If I understand this, it is basically a way for Walker to set deadlines for pushing this dispute to a conclusion. I’m sure D-Is (proponents) will submit the required response, saying that the non-parties have not complied, setting the stage for these parties to be held in contempt.

    The above is just my interpretation of what’s going to play out. I may be mis-understanding the procedural posture and I can’t be sure how ACLU/EQCA will proceed from here.

    • 98. K!r!lleXXI  |  April 13, 2010 at 1:15 pm

      Kathleen, so what’s after April 16th and how long do we expect to wait till closing arguments? I mean how long it may take the court to examine those new documents from ACLU and EQCA? Is there a limit of time for that sort of thing? I’m sure Walker is interested in moving the case along as soon as possible. It’s been almost 3 months since January 27th!

    • 100. Kathleen  |  April 13, 2010 at 1:56 pm

      I’ve been asked to clarify my post.

      The “9th Circuit” refers to the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals. “Proponents” refers to the proponents of Prop 8, i.e., the “Yes on 8″/Defendant-intervenors in the case.

      Straight Grandmother, if you let me know specifically which documents you are trying to find (there have been so many!), I’ll be glad to clarify how to find them.
      The two documents that I’ve referenced in my post can be found here:
      This site appears to be a good source for everyone to keep track of proceedings.

      Also, I can be located on the “Prop 8 Trial Tracker” facebook page (I’ve posted on the wall – Kathleen Perrin). Anyone who is on facebook can send me a private message through fb to request copies of any documents by way of email.

      As to Kirille’s questions.. I really can’t guess on a specific timeline, as there are a lot of variables.

      In terms of procedure, as far as I can tell, the deadline for ACLU/EQCA to produce the requested documents has expired. The original deadline was stayed, pending appeal; that appeal has now been brought to a close. I see nothing that extended the deadline any further and the wording of Walker’s order suggests that he views the deadline as having expired.

      So, I suspect that this order for D-Is to show cause for not closing the evidentiary record is a way for set the stage to hold the ACLU/EQCA in contempt. If that’s the case, it could go like this:
      – The D-Is will respond to Walker’s order by saying the record should not be closed because the non-parties ACLU/EQCA have not complied with the discovery order.
      – In response, Walker will hold the non-parties in contempt.
      – Now the ACLU/EQCA can argue that the 9th Circuit has jurisdiction for an appeal, and appeal.

      The above scenario is just speculation on my part. The ruling from the 9th Circuit (denying ACLU/EQCA’s appeal) suggested that there may be some error in the original discovery order, so I think an appeal is likely.

      I also read somewhere that the D-Is have filed a motion requesting writ by the US Supreme Court on this issue. There was a suggestion that if the 9th Circuit denied the third party appeal, it would moot that request. I’ll try to find out more about this and post it here.

      If there are any other questions, please ask and I’ll try to answer.

      • 101. Andrea  |  April 13, 2010 at 3:07 pm

        Could it go like THIS instead?

        – The D-Is will respond to Walker’s order by saying the record should not be closed because the non-parties ACLU/EQCA have not complied with the discovery order.
        – Then Walker can schedule closing arguments, rule for Perry, and we all have June weddings in California and possibly other states too, hooray!

      • 102. Kathleen  |  April 13, 2010 at 3:39 pm


        No matter how the discovery dispute plays out, there’s almost no chance there will be June weddings this year, not even likely next June.

        Even if Walker rules in favor of Plaintiffs, it’s almost a certainty that no marriages will be allowed until this case has exhausted several levels of appeals. As has been stated before, this will be a multi-year process.

      • 103. Straight Grandmother  |  April 13, 2010 at 3:48 pm

        Kathleen, good idea to keep all these comments under your original posting. Yes one more question you wrote-

        ” also read somewhere that the D-Is have filed a motion requesting writ by the US Supreme Court on this issue. There was a suggestion that if the 9th Circuit denied the third party appeal, it would moot that request”

        What is a writ by the Supreme Court? and what does Moot that request mean??

      • 104. Kathleen  |  April 13, 2010 at 4:06 pm

        Straight Grandmother,
        What is a writ by the Supreme Court?
        I was referring to the filing of a “petition for a writ of certiorari.” That is, they’ve filed formal request that the (US) Supreme Court hear the appeal.

        what does Moot that request mean?
        The discussion I read about this request was that Proponents seemed to want the Supreme Court to review this only if ACLU/EQCA were successful in their appeal to the 9th Circuit. It’s not clear to me if Proponents’ request would be withdrawn now that the 9th Circuit has dismissed the appeal, or if they would leave the request standing until all chances for an appeal of the order have expired.

        BTW, I’m glad you’re asking these questions. If it’s not clear to you, then I’m sure it’s not clear to some other people.

    • 105. Kathleen  |  April 13, 2010 at 2:58 pm

      Somehow, didn’t thread the post properly. Again… At the top of the page are the three briefs that were filed with the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals on the question of jurisdiction:

      Also, at the bottom of the above article there is a discussion of the Proponents’ filing a petition with the US Supreme Court. From the article “Proponents asked the Supreme Court to hold the petition pending the outcome of the case brought by Equality California, ACLU, and other No on 8 groups.”

      I don’t know that means Proponents will withdraw their petition, now that the appeal has been dismissed by the 9th Circuit, or if they’ll keep it active until all chances of further appeal have expired. (i.e., if ACLU/EQCA found in contempt and appeal)

      I haven’t yet located proponents’ original petition to the Supremes. If anyone find it online, let me know.

  • 106. Straight Grandmother  |  April 13, 2010 at 1:08 pm

    This video cracked me up
    Ronnie would love this

    • 107. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 13, 2010 at 1:16 pm

      Yes, I believe Ronnie posted this very video on an earlier thread. Betty is just so funny!

      • 108. Straight Grandmother  |  April 13, 2010 at 1:18 pm

        Yeah where is Ronnie? I admit to not following this website as frequently as I used to.

      • 109. fiona64  |  April 13, 2010 at 3:59 pm

        After being told that he should commit suicide, and that a certain poster here hoped he would acquire AIDS, Ronnie decided to stop posting. :-( I believe he reads sometimes.

        I have to say, I don’t blame him. I find myself saddened almost daily at how hateful some people on this board can be.


      • 110. K!r!lleXXI  |  April 14, 2010 at 11:45 am

        Ronnie, Fiona, Andrea, Bob, Kirill — that’s just a little list of people who became victims of one certain unhappy and very bitter person whose attacks have gotten so violent that he promised pretty much to get the latter one killed.

        Now, I just want to clarify something: I didn’t want to say anything to that person anymore, and didn’t want to cause any more trouble to anyone, especially to him, but I know that many people have been complaining about that person before, and now that person was officially banned from P8TT. I had nothing to do with that decision (I didn’t even complain); however, I’m afraid, it only escalated his motivations, and now he’s pretty sure I got him banned (well, that’s not the only delusion he suffers from). He promised to return saying he’s “unbannable” (making up words here).

        Had I known about that person’s recent behavior prior to the accident, I would never have said the things I’ve said. I deeply regret reacting to his foolishness the way I did and I apologize to all the good people here who had to witness that unfortunate spat! Maybe I’ll have to pay for that with my own blood — we’ll have to see if he indeed goes through with his devious plan to get me killed.

        The only question is, “Does the punishment fit the crime?” Apparently, sarcasm and free speech — sharing information that is absolutely publicly available to anyone online — is a good enough reason to sentence someone to capital punishment. Am I the only one who thinks this is batshit crazy? Well, time will tell.

        I have no further comment. Only one more thing: I am grateful to have found this wonderful blog and this wonderful community; but, moreover, I am grateful to have met here the person who, for the first time in my entire life, have awakened in me true love feelings I never really hoped to experience, and I am lucky to have my feeling reciprocated — whatever happens now, I got to know what it means to love and be loved back, I am happy and I have no regrets. If you read this — I love you, F! Forever.

        –Kirill, Russian dumbass

      • 111. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 14, 2010 at 12:07 pm

        Kirill, you are not the one to blame for another person’s actions. I am sorry you have had to change your picture on here, but I totally understand. One of the reasons I refrained from posting anything in response to that individual unless absolutely necessary is becaues there were times his actions reminded me of my adoptive “father’s” actions when I was growing up, and I hated having to walk on eggshells during my first 18 years of life in order to keep the peace, especially when that did not work very often. And I am so glad you have found love. I konw what a HUGE difference it has made in my life, and I am sure it has made the same difference in yours. MAZEL TOV!!!

      • 112. fiona64  |  April 14, 2010 at 12:33 pm

        While I did not complain either, one must remember that there are moderators reading this blog. The only person who “got him banned” is the one who wrote those nasty, attacking posts — the person who is now banned, in other words.

        Refusing to take responsibility for the consequences of one’s actions demonstrates a sad immaturity, IMO.

        I hope you will continue to post, K. If not, I will see you on FB.


      • 113. Andrea  |  April 14, 2010 at 12:58 pm

        I can’t believe what that troll did to Kirill. And to you too, Fiona64; I somehow missed that exchange. Yikes. Hopefully we can get back to quality, insightful conversation now.

      • 114. fiona64  |  April 14, 2010 at 1:15 pm

        Andrea, a certain troll got very upset when I told him he was incorrect about a legal matter (after he accused me of being unaware — and provided wrong information to boot). The only thing I did was point him to the source for the correct response, and I was subjected to at least half a dozen obscenity-laden, ad hominem attack posts. Several other people provided information showing that I was correct, and he continued to post attacks that he posited as “defending his position.” The whole thing was absurd, and I stayed away for several days. The only reason I came back at all was a couple of nice, private notes from Ronnie and Kathleen.

        I am very sorry for everyone else whom he has attacked here. As someone else posted, it’s time that this site stopped eating its young.


      • 115. David Kimble  |  April 14, 2010 at 1:53 pm

        @ all, who are wondering where Ronnie went to – I have been communicating with him through e-mails. The certain, “troll” you have been discussing upset him so much, he is taking a break from the website for a time.
        <3 David

  • 116. Straight Grandmother  |  April 13, 2010 at 1:16 pm

    Could you kindly take antoher shot at explaining this, dumb it down a little. For example instead of saying “The 9th Circuit” please add “the Court of Appeals” if that is appropriate.

    and this “Proponents have made no submission or motion to supplement the trial record. Accordingly, proponents are ORDERED to ” who are the proponents? You have been following these discovery proceedings with the docs. I need a catch me up to speed lesson about now as I don’t ahve the docs, LOL. You previously listed a link to the docs but I never could find them at the link your provided, although I didn’t say anything at the time.
    MAN it feels good to be talkign about the trial again.

    Do you suppose we might actually get a topic started about this discovery issue?

    • 117. Kathleen  |  April 13, 2010 at 1:24 pm

      Will do. I’ll post my response so it will thread as a reply to my original post.

  • 118. Kathleen  |  April 13, 2010 at 2:34 pm

    Constance named Grand Marshal of NYC Pride Parade

    • 119. Joel  |  April 13, 2010 at 2:55 pm

      See! Perhaps Constance will step up and become the face of our movement! She’s intelligent, attractive, well-spoken, and certainly no one to shirk the public eye.

  • 120. Zander  |  April 13, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    I hate to say it, but more and more people on here are getting to be pretty hateful. I know that I don’t comment that often, however, I do read the comments…

    It saddens me a bit to see that we lose people like Ronnie by others’ negativity… some of the comments on this site are down right hateful, ignorant and people need to learn to rally together, instead forcing our group apart. Instead of attacking with hateful language and slurs, we need to be supportive and get our heads out of our asses. I feel that if we can not work together and be supportive we are no better than the WBC.

  • 121. Zander  |  April 13, 2010 at 4:47 pm

    That comment wasn’t to everyone, btw, we do have some wonderful, caring people on this site that frequently comment, and I encourage those people to keep posting.

    • 122. Straight Ally #3008  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:43 pm

      In an effort to brighten the mood, I present a cat standing up. :)

      • 123. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:46 pm

        I LOVE it! BTW, just got a text from Ronnie. He’s working on designs for a DWTS contest. I hope he wins.

      • 124. Kathleen  |  April 13, 2010 at 6:58 pm

        Love it! Seems to be watching birdies (or other animal) out the window — or as we call it: Kitty TV

      • 125. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 13, 2010 at 7:09 pm

        Either that, or he sees one of his people coming up the walk with that ever-important bag that has his dinner in it!

      • 126. fiona64  |  April 14, 2010 at 3:43 pm

        I hope he wins, too! The winning designs will be worn by Melissa Rycroft and Joey Fatone when they perform the “design-a-dance.” That would be a real feather in Ronnie’s cap.


      • 127. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 14, 2010 at 3:57 pm

        And a feather he so richly deserves!

  • 128. Zander  |  April 13, 2010 at 7:15 pm

    ^_^ I love the standing kitty

  • 129. Dave P  |  April 13, 2010 at 10:04 pm

    An observation about the behavior on this site – There is a huge difference between strongly defending your position and lowering yourself to vulgar personal attacks. As a long time reader, I ask that those who are doing this please STOP IT. Can’t you see how destructive this is? You are doing far more harm than any of the trolls who have been here. Don’t you realize how this affects all of us? And you? It makes me cringe with embarassment and shame when I think that these vulgar childish attacks are being read by anti-gay lurkers, and even worse – by people who are in the middle and may be here looking for info about the issue of same sex marriage and the trial. How can you justify this destructive negative behavior, knowing that you are alienating people who we need as our allies?? Believe me, I know as well as any of us that we have plenty of reason to be angry and frustrated. But please, I’m begging you, find some way to channel it that does not involve destroying the sense of community and cooperation that this site so desperately needs. If you simply cannot refrain from immature potty-mouth snarking, please go do it on THE OPPOSITIONS web sites.

  • 130. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  April 14, 2010 at 3:59 pm

    Ronnie just sent me an email with a link everybody here may want to click on. They burned the flag at the NYC LGBT center. But Andy and his gang are so afraid that the Prop H8 supporters will be attacked.

  • 131. Ronnie  |  April 14, 2010 at 4:07 pm

    Ok everybody the Betch Drama Queen is back……..

    Posted on April 14, 2010
    NYC Gay Center’s Flag Burned
    By Michelle Garcia

    The staff at the LGBT Community Center of New York City arrived at work Wednesday to find that a rainbow flag that once flew in front of the building had been burned.

    (me) ah oh.ohhhhh…..steam is literally shooting out of my ears…….

    According to a press release, police were called, and investigators from the hate-crimes unit and the center’s local precinct were dispatched to the crime scene.

    (me) hate crime?… no no no no no….this is more then a hate crime……

    “We at the center will not stand for anyone who thinks they can come into our community and try to intimidate us,” center executive director Glennda Testone said in a statement. “We work hard to create a safe environment and provide a safe space for all LGBT New Yorkers. Hate and intolerance against us will not be accepted in New York, and it is so important the center is a safe space in our city.”

    Anyone with information is urged to contact the police at (800) 577-TIPS.

    (me) I’m sorry but in every civilized society in known history and present day….burning another’s flag is an act of war…..As far as I’m concerned Civil War II has just started…..did I not tell you?…..hmmm…?????……<3….Ronnie

    • 132. Straight Ally #3008  |  April 14, 2010 at 7:23 pm

      Ronnie, these cowards are using terror tactics – no better than the KKK. (Good to see you, btw!)

      Seriously, folks – what sort of hate crimes have been perpetrated against the prop 8 side? As far as I can tell, the worst they’ve had to deal with boycotts and online mockery. Such a false persecution complex.

      • 133. Ronnie  |  April 14, 2010 at 7:36 pm

        good to see you too, well I’ve been reading… I have seen you…lol….anywho….they’re worse then the Triple K….they hide and lie about who and what they really are….its sad and pathetic….and they really have no idea what they’re getting themselves into…..<3….Ronnie

  • […] The Courage Campaign is reporting that the amount of signatures needed to get an initiative to repeal Prop 8 on the 2010 ballot was not reached.  Despite the efforts of countless volunteers, the near 700,000 signatures that were needed was not obtained.  Sadly, this means that Prop 8 will remain as is until the 2012 ballot when activists will have another shot at getting it on the ballot.  To read the full story from the Courage Campaign please click here. […]


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