August 3, 2010 at 4:25 pm 246 comments

By Eden James, Courage Campaign Institute

Exciting news! Judge Vaughn Walker has come to a decision in the Perry v. Schwarzenegger case.

This just in from the American Foundation for Equal Rights:

The federal court announced today that it will release its decision in the American Foundation for Equal Right’s landmark case, Perry v. Schwarzenegger, on Wednesday. Text “EQUAL” to 69866 to get a text message with the official decision on your mobile phone the moment the court releases its decision, or sign-up for an email alert at Join AFER on its Web site to watch a live press conference with our plaintiffs and co-counsels Ted Olson and David Boies following the release of the decision. As we receive news about the details of the release, AFER will update our Facebook and Twitter profiles, along with our Web site.

More from the court:

On August 4, 2010, the court will issue its written order containing findings of fact and conclusions of law following the court trial held in January and June of this year. The order will be e-filed in the court’s Electronic Case Filing system, and will be immediately available thereafter through ECF and PACER. Visit for details on registering for PACER. There will be no court proceeding associated with the publication of the order.

A small number of hard copies will also be made available for public review shortly after the order is e-filed in the following locations:

San Francisco Courthouse: Clerk’s Office (16th Floor) & Press Room (18th Floor)

Oakland Courthouse: Clerk’s Office

San Jose Courthouse: Clerk’s Office

More news to come as it develops. If you have news to share, please post it in the comments!


Well, it looks like tomorrow is the big day. Judge Walker will finally issue a ruling in the federal Prop 8 litigation:

District Court Judge Vaughn Walker will issue a decision Wednesday on the constitutional challenge to California’s Proposition 8, the ban on same-sex marriage, according to a court announcement today.

Walker’s written order will be released electronically Wednesday – no hour was given – and will later be available for public review in federal courthouses in San Francisco, Oakland and San Jose.(SacBee)

I am actually fairly optimistic here that Judge Walker will strike down Prop 8, at least as far as the inequity between married same-sex couples and those who missed the cut-off. That much, at the very least, seems to be something of a narrow decision that many judges like to make.

However, Judge Walker seemed to be hinting at wanting to take a bigger stand during the closing arguments. Now, hints are essentially meaningless. I might as well try reading my cranium for clues, but that optimism in me keeps rearing its head.

In legal terms, it all comes down to two questions:

1. What standard should the court review Prop 8 under?

2. How does the court complete the analysis based on that standard

Now, as I’ve mentioned in the past, there are basically three choices for the standard: “rational basis”, intermediate, and strict scrutiny. Under strict scrutiny, getting a law that discriminates to pass constitutional muster is extremely difficult. It would have to be narrowly tailored to an important state interest. On the flip side, under rational basis review, the court need only find a rational basis for the discrimination for any state interest whatsoever.

Now, that last one sounds pretty broad. However, the Defense of Marriage Act (Section 3) was recently struck down under this standard. In that case, the Court said that the federal government simply had no interest whatsoever in regulating marriage. Now, this is slightly different, as we are talking about a traditional basis of state power and a state regulation. But all that is to say that even if Judge Walker uses the rational basis test, all is not lost.

The decision will appear on the Northern District’s website some time tomorrow.

UPDATE BY EDEN: For information on Day of Decision Community Response rallies across California and the country, check out the page below (it’s being updated frequently, apparently):

UPDATE BY EDEN: Andy Kelley, the Courage Campaign Institute’s New Media Organizer, just sent this to our Facebook Causes community:

To be the first to know Judge Walker’s ruling tomorrow, the moment it is announced, follow Testimony: Equality On Trial on Facebook. We will be providing live updates, including Judge Walker’s ruling, actions you can take, and how to plug in to local Day of Decision rallies in your community.

Will you join us on Facebook? Click here to “like” the Testimony: Equality on Trial fanpage and show your support for marriage equality. Then click on “Suggest to Friends” to help us be ready to act.

UPDATE BY EDEN: For those in the L.A. area, AFER’s Adam Umhoefer sent out the following prior to the decision date being announced:

Regardless of the outcome, this event will mark a significant moment for our community. The eyes and ears of the nation will be focused on us immediately following the court’s decision. We have a tremendous opportunity to showcase our families and dispel the discriminatory myths about gays and lesbians and their children propagated by our opponents. By attending and speaking honestly about your lives and what marriage means to your family, we can change hearts and minds across the nation.

Also critically important is a strong showing from the LGBT community and our allies. We want everyone to know the breadth and depth of our commitment to bring about marriage equality as soon as possible. So we ask you to please join us, bring signs, and help make this Decision Day a memorable day in the struggle for equality.


AFER Prop. 8 Day of Decision Community Gathering
6:00pm – 8:00pm
West Hollywood Park
647 N San Vicente Blvd
West Hollywood, CA

Recommended Entrance on San Vicente Blvd

UPDATE BY EDEN: More from an AFER press release:


Official Events in San Francisco, West Hollywood (Los Angeles) After Decision is Released

The court announced today that a decision in the landmark Perry v. Schwarzenegger trial will be announced Wednesday, August 4. The American Foundation for Equal Rights – the organization that launched the Perry v. Schwarzenegger case and brought together attorneys Theodore Olson and David Boies to argue it – will hold a news conference in San Francisco immediately after a decision is announced and will hold a public event later in the day in West Hollywood (Los Angeles). Both events will include the plaintiffs, lead attorneys and Foundation leadership.


Official Plaintiffs Post-Decision Events/Immediate Reaction


*Perry v. Schwarzenegger/Prop. 8 Trial Plaintiffs Kris Perry, Sandy Stier, Paul Katami, Jeff Zarrillo

*Lead attorneys Theodore Olson and David Boies

*American Foundation for Equal Rights Board President Chad Griffin


*San Francisco News Conference: Immediately after decision is issued

*Los Angeles Public Event: 4:30 PM (Time Tentative) (NOTE BY EDEN: 4:30 appears to be the press event, whereas 6-8 p.m. is the scheduled time for the public event, as noted in the previous update).
UPDATE: WEHO/LA Event Time Now Tentatively 6:00 PM


*San Francisco News Conference:

The Bentley Reserve
301 Battery Street
San Francisco, CA 94111

*Los Angeles Public Event:

West Hollywood Park
647 N. San Vicente
West Hollywood, CA 90069

UPDATE BY EDEN: This just in from the court’s media liaison:

The Perry order will be e-filed between 1 pm and 3 pm tomorrow. It will be available electronically to the public not only through PACER but also directly from the court’s website, , free of charge soon after it is e-filed.

Assume, 1-3 pm on Wednesday is PACIFIC time, as the announcement is being made in San Francisco.

UPDATE BY EDEN: From our friends at, which has been re-enacting the Prop. 8 trial online, will be re-enacting Judge Walker’s verdict in a live webcast when it is released in print on Wednesday. Access the live webcast here.

Entry filed under: Community/Meta, Trial analysis.

Sioux City: NOM goes for the parking lot trifecta DECISION DAY: Everything you need to know about the Prop 8 trial

246 Comments Add your own

  • 1. nightshayde  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:27 pm

    What time? Is there a standard time for decisions to be made available?

    • 2. Eden James  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:12 pm

      Just posted a few minutes ago:

      UPDATE BY EDEN: This just in from the court’s media liaison:

      The Perry order will be e-filed between 1 pm and 3 pm tomorrow. It will be available electronically to the public not only through PACER but also directly from the court’s website, , free of charge soon after it is e-filed.

      • 3. nightshayde  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:38 pm

        Thank you for the update, Eden!

    • 4. Mouse  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:55 pm

      I am so excited. I do so hope that justice is served tomorrow. It would be crushing to lose after that pathetic defense of this discriminatory prop.

  • 5. Dan Hess  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:27 pm

    Alright!!! Let’s hear it for Ted Olson and David Boies, everybody! We’re winning this, we all know it! I only hope Walker doesn’t stay the ruling pending appeal–national marriage equality, anyone? ^_^

  • 6. Gew  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:27 pm

    I predict a ruling against Prop 8 and an immediate appeal to SCOTUS.

    • 7. Rob  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:32 pm

      The appeal would actually go to the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals first. SCOTUS comes later =)

    • 8. Dan Hess  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:01 pm

      Oh, of course. But those’ll never be overturned, it was absolutely clear that the other side had NO case whatsoever. We’ve won. Even if Judge Walker DOES stay his ruling, it’s only a matter of time until marriage equality is the law of the land. ^_^

    • 9. Steve  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:29 pm

      The great thing is that they can’t introduce new evidence on appeal. The higher courts will decide the case as it was presented.

  • 10. Bryan  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    WOO-WOOO Bout time! Here’s hoping we get a win!~

    • 11. Felyx  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:42 pm

      It is not a question of Win.. it is a question of how good a Win!

      We will, we will, Rock you! Rock You!!!


      • 12. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:50 pm

      • 13. Bryan  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:18 pm

        You know it! Tomorrow we win, tomorrow night we party, Thursday we prepare for the 9th Circuit and another sure win!

      • 14. Bolt  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:57 pm

        Yeah! Turn it out, Lesbians Love Boies!

  • 15. nightshayde  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    I may need to take an extra blood pressure pill tonight. >.>

    • 16. Mouse  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:39 pm


  • 17. Tony Douglass in CA  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    Eden just posted it on the main page, woohoo!!

  • 18. Bob  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    Straight Grandmother, you went to bed too early, but you can rise to this, what we’ve been waiting for.

    • 19. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:11 pm

      And what a wonderful thing for her to wake up to!

    • 20. Straight Grandmother  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:16 am

      Oh my GOD!!!! You are so right, I was very tired last night and WOW look what I wake up to. I will be nervous all day waiting. In a way I think I have it better than all of you in the states. Probably nobody slept last night and at least I got a good nights sleep. I have to figure out the time difference I think 1pm Pacific time is 11pm my time in Provence. I’ll check that in a minute.

      LLB Thanks so much for the Queen song, it was so great. I was pumping my fist in the air and clapping my hands. I know we are gonna win, we are gonna win, we HAVE to WIN!

      What a way to wake up, I am so wide awake right now you wouldn’t believe it. My husband just came in and I told him the news, he also is so excited.

      To those Special needs Families this is soooo big. Thinking you also Felyx and Kevyn.

      • 21. Felyx  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:27 am

        Nous pensons aussi à toi ma chére! We are also thinking of you! F et K

      • 22. ĶĭŗîļĺęΧҲΪ  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:59 am

        Thank you, Granny!
        We all are thinking about the entire community here, I’m sure!
        This is for all of us! This is for all Americans! This is for all the people in the world!

      • 23. Franck  |  August 4, 2010 at 1:13 am

        À vos souhaits, chère Grand-mère. Je crois que le décalage horaire est plutôt de neuf heures entre la Californie et la France, puisque c’est dix heures avec Madagascar. Tout comme vous je ne dormirai probablement pas très bien la nuit prochaine et me précipiterai sur les nouvelles à la première heure demain matin (puis-je crier Peuchère?).

        Attention, les crises cardiaques ne sont pas autorisées! Même si j’en aurai probablement une…

        – Franck P. Rabeson
        Days spent apart from my fiancé because of DOMA: 1139 days, as of today.

      • 24. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 4, 2010 at 10:50 am

        I think that 1pm Pacific time would probably be about midnight your time, Straight Grandmother, because when it is about 3 pm in my time zone you are mentioning that it is 11pm in yours, and I am three hours from the pacific time zone. And you are right, waking up to We Will Rock You is a wonderfully energizing way to wake up. And the news of the ruling on top of that probably has your energy sky high.

      • 25. Kathleen  |  August 4, 2010 at 11:10 am

        I think they’re 9 hours ahead of California time, but I get confused about the Daylight Savings Time, so that could be off by an hour.

      • 26. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 4, 2010 at 11:23 am

        Those freakish time zone changes confuse the heck out of me..Arizonan MST (our time zone NEVER changes). I always have to ask clients when confirming future meeting times, “What time is it there now?”

      • 27. JonT  |  August 4, 2010 at 11:25 am

        Try the world clock –

  • 28. Ann S.  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    Good God, Man!

    • 29. Ann S.  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:32 pm


      • 30. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:47 pm


      • 31. Dave in Maine  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:51 pm

        I’m late!!!

  • 32. Bolt  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    This is so cool. Very happy. Horray for everyone!

  • 33. eDee  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:32 pm

    I’m assuming I’ll only get a TEXT on the verdict if I sign up?
    I hope, because I did it, because I want to know the first possible moment!!!

  • 34. ĶĭŗîļĺęΧҲΪ  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:33 pm


  • 35. Skemono  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    Anyone up for a rendition of “Tomorrow”?

    • 36. AndrewPDX  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:46 pm

      How about the song “There’s Always Tomorrow For Dreams to Come True,” which is sung by Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer’s girlfriend, Clarice.

      :) yes, I’m just a big kid at heart :)


      • 37. fiona64  |  August 4, 2010 at 8:42 am

        That song makes me cry.


  • 38. l8r_g8r  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:35 pm

    *runs screaming away from the office*

    *realizes she still has to bill more time for the day and runs screaming back*

    • 39. Gew  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:37 pm

      I like the screaming part

    • 40. nightshayde  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:55 pm


    • 41. Ann S.  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:58 pm

      @l8r, that’s my dilemma, too! Must try to work lots tonight so that I can scream more tomorrow!

      • 42. nightshayde  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:04 pm

        I will have to find something suitably rainbowy to wear to work tomorrow. =)

      • 43. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:06 pm

        I will wear my Lesbian’s Love Boies tomorrow…

        I have to take my dog to the vet for surgery in the morning, and I will wear it proudly.

        Tomorrow is too long a wait though!

      • 44. nightshayde  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:10 pm

        I just remembered I made some fabulous rainbow earrings a few years ago. I’ll have to wear them tomorrow (not sure I have anything else rainbowy that would meet the lenient work dress code).

      • 45. l8r_g8r  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:18 pm

        I have to attend a hearing tomorrow morning. Part of me hopes that the decision comes out after my hearing so I can get it as it happens. The other part wants the decision to be posted first thing in the morning, even if I’m still at the hearing, so that the world can know!

    • 46. Ann S.  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:08 pm

      For Day of Decision events, see your local group here:

      • 47. Elsie  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:15 pm

        Thanks! I will be going to the San Francisco one for sure.

    • 48. Ann S.  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:21 pm

      Reason no. 98,754 that I’m glad I don’t do litigation.

  • 49. DazedWheels  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:37 pm

    subscribing (and I love you all!!!)

  • 50. eDee  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:39 pm

    I am so excited I’m sick!
    I don’t even know why I’m this excited, I just can’t help myself.

    • 51. Sean  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:10 pm

      I feel the same way! Even though I’m about 99% sure there’s no way in hell we could lose this after the defense’s epic fail in the courtroom…I’m still nervous as heck! AGH!!

      …is it Wednesday yet?

      • 52. nightshayde  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:13 pm

        That’s EXACTLY how I feel, Sean.

      • 53. eDee  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:58 pm

        There is NO WAY I’m sleeping tonight.

        Every American should have the same Rights and Freedoms as I do and it pains me to know that some do not.

        I just can’t rest until I know that All Americans are Equal and Free.

      • 54. Dave in ME  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:02 pm

        Yes, I feel that way too. I feel very optimistic about this, but still, it isn’t over until the verdict is read (at least THIS phase isn’t over…).


      • 55. Sean  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:19 pm

        Part of the problem of living on the east coast is that YOUR one to three is OUR four to six. That’s a lot of sitting and waiting anxiously!

        Regardless, I wish everyone here a good night of sleep tonight! Whatever the outcome is, we will prevail!!

    • 56. AndrewPDX  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:21 pm

      Ditto… Reminds me of the Disneyland commercial “I’m too excited to sleep” :)


  • 57. Mark  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:39 pm

    July 4th is Independence Day. Let August 4th be OUR Independence Day!

    • 58. Straight Grandmother  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:21 am

      Oh my gosh Mark that is a good one.

  • 59. Elsie  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:40 pm

    : ) and \ o /

  • 60. Rick  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:40 pm

    Free at last, free at last (I hope, I hope).

    • 61. Dan Hess  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:04 pm

      We’ve won this one, but the game’ll never really be over. There’ll always be SOMEONE that the majority thinks it can trample on and withhold rights from. And people like us will be there to stop them. We’re the best, everyone! High fives and free beer for all!

  • 62. Bob  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    the ruling comes too late for baby Roy, but my prayer tonight will be that the ruling will be in favour of promoting a safer world,
    One in which Rainbow Children will be prized and honored ,

    Saying you acted like a girl doesn’t make you a Rainbow Child, and you died too early to tell us yourself. But may the ruling have an impact that changes sexual stereotypes into the future, so men aren’t afraid of differences.

    • 63. l8r_g8r  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:48 pm

      What the bigots are afraid of is a world in which it is not acceptable to beat your child to stop him from acting like a girl. Why are they so afraid of treating people like human beings, with dignity?

  • 64. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:44 pm

    This is kind of like Christmas eve as a kid…

  • 66. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:48 pm

    I put a bottle of champagne in the fridge for tomorrow’s decision!

    • 67. Dan Hess  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:17 pm

      Wish I weren’t out of Bailey’s or I’d drink a toast myself ^_^

      • 68. nightshayde  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:08 pm

        You might have time to buy a bottle before tomorrow.

        I’m just sayin’ … ;o)~

    • 69. Mark M  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:07 pm

      I did the same!
      We can toast together sweetie!!!

    • 70. Straight Grandmother  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:30 am

      So interesting that you said that as not more than 5 minutes ago I was thinking to myself I better put in a bottle of Champagne.

  • 71. Jeff  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:48 pm

    Not sure how Im going to get any sleep tonight now…

  • 72. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    This will be a lovely anniversary present for Mark and me. We will be celebrating our tenth on Aug 6th (Hiroshima day, I know), and our legal marriage was performed on the 28th of August.

    • 73. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:55 pm

      Congrats Joel and Mark! ps. aug 6 is my birthday : ) GREAT day!

    • 74. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:56 pm


    • 75. Mark M  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:07 pm


  • 76. Dan Hess  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:53 pm

    I’ll gladly celebrate the verdict with you guys. Anyone in Maryland want to get married once this is finalized? ^_^

    • 77. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:56 pm

      Well, I’d marry you, but I live in NY. :P

    • 78. Dan Hess  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:07 pm

      Ha, not what I meant. I’m a priest, if someone wants a religious marriage in Maryland and is having trouble finding someone to perform the ceremony, I’ll be glad to help. Not the best priest, but I’d be honored to officiate at anyone’s wedding if they’d have me. =)

      • 79. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:43 pm

        Are you legal for DC? That could save me and BZ a trip if you are. This way we could go a head and schedule a time with you and hopefully only have to make one trip instead of two.

  • 80. Alan E.  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    I just made plans to leave work early to head to the Castro!

    • 81. Dpeck  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:47 pm

      Me too! I’ll be wearing a T-shirt with a picture of Harvey Milk on the front and “YOU GOTTA GIVE ‘EM HOPE” in huge black letters on the back. Say hi if ya see me!

  • 82. Dan Hess  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:56 pm

    Also, I’m curious. I recently found out I have an HQ of 119, putting me in the top 3% of all humans for hippie-ness. Do I strike you guys as a hippie? ^_^

    • 83. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:57 pm

      I dunno. Do you drive a Toyota?

      • 84. Dan Hess  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:00 pm

        Hyundai, actually. And I did at one point own a hippie van… I miss that thing. Might have to get another one if next summer’s road trip plans come together. ^_^

  • 85. Joshua  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:58 pm

    I can’t wait for tomorrow!

  • 86. Tigger  |  August 3, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    Somberly praying for and visualizing a sound defeat to Prop H8…suspect class designation…and equal protection and due process language so unequivocal that it will be bullet proof on appeal…

    All in the name of the population of our adolescent gay brothers & sisters that have been beaten, abused, thrown out of their homes, or killed themselves in despair in thinking they could never have the stable & respected love and life for which they had always dreamed.

    • 87. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:00 pm

      Very well said Tigger!

    • 88. StraightForEquality  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:21 pm

      I’ll drink to that!

  • 89. Ronnie  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:00 pm

    Hmmmm…. : I ….Ronnie

    • 90. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:17 pm

      I don’t think I’ve ever seen YOU at a loss for words.

      BIG HUG!

      • 91. Mark M  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:10 pm

        colorful four letter ones at that

  • 92. Dan Hess  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:19 pm

    Oh gods, I’m so excited. I love you all! -überhug-

  • 93. ChrisQ  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    Really interesting timing in the midst of the NOMbie tour. Hoping for the best. But truly what I am feeling is that this Righteous War will not be won on the ground alone. It needs to be won in a sweeping SCOTUS decision (a la Roe, a la Brown, a la Loving v. Virginia) and let the chips – and the bigotry – fall where they may. There will be harsh blow back for sure for awhile, and a lot of howling from the Wingnutz. But I think what plays in our favor is time: Iowa & Mass have not fallen apart culturally, but the economy has. People have learned to respect each other the old fashioned way: by kindness, exposure, truth, respect for their neighbor, and tolerance. I think this terrible economy might ultimately work in our favor. The Right has too many “fires” to put out (health care reform, financial reform, big business and the preservation of tax cuts for the wealthy, and making Obama into a socialist) and the culture wars don’t really count for sh**t with John Doe Public when his house is being foreclosed on. Plus, the Tea Parties are all about states rights. Still, chances are the queens next door were smart enough with their money to keep their condo. We did. And some of us might just extend a helping hand when the chips are down for our straight brothers, sisters and families. We have. I’m a great cook, and love making sure people of all sexual preferences have a good meal.

    So, I take comfort in knowing we are on the right side of history. As a human being in my 40s, I just hope I live to see it.

    “I am still not a political person, but I am proud that Richard’s and my name is on a court case that can help reinforce the love, the commitment, the fairness, and the family that so many people, black or white, young or old, gay or straight seek in life. I support the freedom to marry for all. That’s what Loving, and loving, are all about. ”
    -Mildred Jeter Loving

    How dare NOM say these two causes are not united? Have they read the words of one of the plaintiff?

    Sending out good and postive NRG to all of you out there who believe that the truth and goodness can win.

  • 94. JonT  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:28 pm

    Woohoo! Geez, wonder what I’ll be doing tommorrow. I just saw this on towleroad and was going to post it. No need I guess :)

  • 95. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:29 pm

    Now that the day is nigh, I’m curious as to how this ruling will affect Mark and me, living as we do in NV with a legal marriage certificate from CA. I know the initial ruling won’t affect us at all, but assuming Judge Walker rules in favor of the plaintiffs (as he must, right?), and assuming it will go to appeal at the District level (which seems to be what everyone thinks will happen) and assuming that the District Court of Appeals upholds Judge Walker’s ruling (may he have written an airtight ruling), well, isn’t NV part of the Ninth District? Will that ruling affect NV’s constitutional amendment? Will NV have to recognize our CA marriage?

    Please forgive my ignorance.

    • 96. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:36 pm

      No, sadly, the only state this ruling could affect immediately would be California. But in the long run, it could go a big part of the way to making your marriage legal everywhere.

    • 97. Anna Bryan  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:43 pm

      Actually, that all depends on how narrow or broad the Judge’s decision is. You’ll have to wait until tomorrow to see if it might affect you. Most analysts think he will take the narrowest route – meaning it will be specific for CA. However, some of his questions seemed to indicate he was at least considering a broader ruling that might affect all of the US.

  • 98. Steve  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    So what does a win mean in practice? Will marriage become legal again immediately or does that have to wait until all the appeals courts have decided?

    • 99. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:37 pm

      I think that depends on exactly what the ruling is, Steve. He might rule that it is overturned immediately, or he might rule that it goes directly to appeal, and has to wait for that verdict for the ruling to be enacted.

      • 100. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:44 pm

        If Judge Walker rules the way we hope he will, the defense will ask for a stay pending appeal. If the stay is granted, then marriage equality will have a little farther to go in California. If they stay is denied, then marriages can start the day that it is, I imagine…

  • 101. nightshayde  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:33 pm

    On a semi-related tangent —

    What’s going on with the two DOMA cases in Massachusetts? Is the US Government letting the rulings stand, or is there an appeal in the works?

    Didn’t they have a fairly short time-window in which they had to respond?

    • 102. Anna Bryan  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:40 pm

      16 days mandatory stay. They had 60 or 90 days to appeal (I forgot which).

    • 103. Aya  |  August 4, 2010 at 7:55 am

      I believe it’s 60 days, so fingers crossed they’ll just leave it be. I haven’t heard otherwise yet.

      • 104. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 4, 2010 at 11:50 am

        Actually, Aya, if the DOJ does not appeal it, the decision is not as binding a precedent as if the MA DOMA decision is appealed and upheld at the next level up. So we would really be better off it is appealed than if it is left alone. If it is appealed and upheld on appeal, then other states can refer to this as a binding precedent, and have a stronger legal leg to stand on.

      • 105. Sagesse  |  August 4, 2010 at 11:54 am

        And aren’t there several states in the same circuit with Massachusetts that are marriage equality states?

      • 106. Kathleen  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:02 pm

        Just New Hampshire.

      • 107. Ann S.  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:03 pm

        Not Connecticut?

      • 108. Kathleen  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:06 pm

        Connecticut is 2nd

      • 109. Ann S.  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:08 pm

        @Kathleen — Got it, thanks.

      • 110. Sagesse  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:15 pm


        Well, two out of five +DC ain’t bad.

      • 111. Kathleen  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:25 pm

        DC is its own Circuit. Don’t think upholding the DOMA cases in the 1st Circuit wouldn’t make it binding precedent in DC.

      • 112. Sagesse  |  August 4, 2010 at 12:32 pm


        Just sayin’… winning on appeal gets one-third of only six jurisdictions that could benefit today. We should take it.

  • 113. Matthew  |  August 3, 2010 at 5:47 pm

    I’m so not gonna be able to sleep tonight. More time for Starcraft II I guess.

    Congratz on your tenth Mark and Joel. My husbear and I celebrate our 10th anniversary on sept 4th!

    • 114. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:03 pm

      Thanks very much, and back atcha!

  • 115. Balu  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    There goes my Wednesday at work, how can I concentrate…. hopeless for work, hopeful for equality. :)

    • 116. Lauren  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:06 pm


      Strike it down!

  • 117. Dave in ME  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:05 pm

    Argh, and I am on the east coast. California doesn’t even get started, really, until NOON here!!!


  • 118. Alan E.  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:08 pm

    For any of you who will be in San Francisco tomorrow, I will be holding a sign that says Lesbians Love Boies on one side and Gays Love Boies on the other. I also might wear my pink shirt (if my husband determines that it’s not too wrinkled) too. Come say hi, introduce yourself, and take a picture with me =>

    • 119. Dave in Maine  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:15 pm

      I WISH I could be there!!! We won’t be there until New Year’s Eve, so we’ll just have to celebrate here in Maine. Probably not as exciting as the Castro!!!


    • 120. Elsie  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:14 pm

      Thanks I’ll be watching for you. I’ll be the short one with a white “Straight But Not Narrow” hat.

    • 121. Greg in OZ  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:39 pm

      Hey Alan,
      Can I take a rain check on that meeting? Im coming over for the Folsom and Castro St fairs in September and would love to meet up with one of the TT folk!
      Greg in Oz

      • 122. Alan E.  |  August 4, 2010 at 8:46 am

        Greg, send me a line when you are here if you want to meet up. Our house is always open if you want a hot meal, too. I must prewarn you that we are in the East Bay and some people in the city think Berkeley is too far away to travel out here (it’s not).

    • 123. Dpeck  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:52 pm

      It may get crazy chatty around here, so in case you missed it above, I’ll be in the Castro too, wearing a T-shirt with a picture of Harvey Milk ont he front and “YOU GOTTA GIVE ‘EM HOPE” on the back. I’ll watch for you!

    • 124. Felyx  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:22 pm

      I suggest you write Gay Boys Love Boies!… sounds cooler that way!

  • 125. Roger  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:15 pm

    *grabs popcorn*

  • 126. DazedWheels  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:15 pm

    I just got a follow-up email from the courts:

    The Perry order will be e-filed between 1 pm and 3 pm tomorrow. It will be available electronically to the public not only through PACER but also directly from the court’s website, , free of charge soon after it is e-filed.

    Lynn Fuller
    Media & Public Outreach Liaison
    United States District Court
    Northern District of California

  • 127. Heather  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:15 pm

    Hey guys,
    For all of you in the Rhode Island area we will be meeting tomorrow at 6:30 pm. We will be meeting at the Federal Courthouse located at 1 Exchange St Providence. Please bring white flowers. Thanks!

    • 128. Mark M  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:18 pm

      That’s so great Heather. White flowers are so symbolic of hope…
      Wonderful idea!
      I want pictures!!

  • 129. Mackenzie  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:16 pm

    I can’t handle this! I am going to be up all night worrying about his. I feel like just going outside and doing something, I was good all summer just thinking about a little from time to time, and then all of a suden….BOOM! I won’t be able to make it. Does anyone have judge Walker’s number? I need to call him now and find out what he has decided! LOL

    • 130. Tim in Sonoma  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:23 pm

      ROFLMAO!! Love it!!

  • 131. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:25 pm

    OMG!!! Finally, the deicision is coming down. Kathleen, what is the normal time of day for something like this, or is there one?

  • 132. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:26 pm

    1 – 3 pm Pacific time! ARgh. Why did California have to go be on the west coast, anyway???

    • 133. RebeccaRGB  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:33 pm

      Lisa: “Because they discovered gold right over there.”
      Homer: “It’s because they’re stupid, that’s why. That’s why everybody does everything.”

  • 134. Ronnie  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:31 pm

    Queer Rising has organized an event in NYC

    251 attending, 353 maybe attending…I’m one of the 353…but I might actually go.


    • 135. Bob  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:52 pm

      yeah Ronnie, hope you go, bet it will be amazing, those guys know how to celebrate,

  • 136. RebeccaRGB  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:32 pm

    I saw a message from a Facebook group announcing this, and my first reaction was no, that can’t be right. It has to be a rumor, just like last time. I know, I’ll check P8TT. That will tell me if it’s for real. HOLY SH*T!!!

  • 137. Jeff  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:35 pm

    How common is it to e-file a ruling?

    • 138. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:13 pm

      Absolutely typical.

  • 139. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:36 pm

    Well, this is what I get for taking a nap. I don’t know what all have been reported.

    Has it been reported that Cooper is requesting a stay pending appeal?

    • 140. Jeff  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:38 pm

      I just read that on Twitter…


      Attys representing anti-marriage equality forces have filed motion to stay pending appeal on tomorrow’s decision in #prop8 case.
      2 minutes ago via web

      • 141. Dave in CA  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:57 pm

        Is this pre-emptive? Normal matter of course? Or do they know something already that tells them they need to ask for that stay?

      • 142. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:02 pm

        Good. That means that they’re planning on filing an appeal even before they hear the ruling. If Judge Walker’s ruling is as tight as we all think it’s going to be, the appeal will be a breeze, I’m sure. And if the Ninth District Court of Appeals upholds Judge Walker’s ruling, then it will apply to the whole Ninth District (that’s my understanding, anyway). Then of course, the defense will appeal to the SCOTUS, and marriage will be open to all as long as there is an America.
        It seems to me that if the defense had half the brains of our brilliant attorneys, they wouldn’t appeal at all, and just let the ruling stand for California. Good thing they’re not too smart!

      • 143. l8r_g8r  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:03 pm

        Joel, that’s pretty much how it works.

        1. Ask for a rehearing by District Court;
        2. Appeal to 9th Circuit;
        3. Ask for rehearing/rehearing en banc;
        4. Petition for Certiorari before USSC.

      • 144. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:22 pm

        I would add that the only appeal that is guaranteed is the appeal to the 9th Circuit (panel). All others are at the discretion of the individual courts.

  • 145. StraightForEquality  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:43 pm

    Does anyone know of anything planned in NH?

  • 146. Casey  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:47 pm

    Guh! I am on the east coast, too! I ahve no idea how I’m going to get through an entire day of work waiting for the ruling to be handed down! Much love and good energy to you all – thank you for giving me so many intelligent posts to read, enjoy, laugh with, and once in a while, respond to. We are a community and WE WILL WIN AT THE SCOTUS!

  • 147. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:49 pm

    UPDATE: I haven’t had a chance to even read these yet. I’m coming out of sleep grogginess and just trying to get these out to everyone as quickly as possible:

    Proponents’ Motion to Stay Pending Appeal w/attached Order

    • 148. l8r_g8r  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:01 pm

      I know this is just a standard motion, but there’s something in me that says, “HA! They filed a motion for stay. They must know they’re going to lose!!!”

      • 149. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:20 pm

        I think they’ve expected to lose now for a long time. Maggie said as much in a press conference after closing arguments, and I think it was clear to them even before that.

        I’m not really a betting person, but I’d be willing to put money on Walker striking down Prop 8. Of course, I’m sure the odds are such that there would be nothing gained in the bet. :)

    • 150. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:12 pm

      Proponents are asking for a stay pending appeal, or if Walker won’t grant that request, then a limited 7 day stay to give them an opportunity to ask the 9th Circuit for a stay.

      They then go through the analysis of why their motion should should be granted, discussing each of the four factors to consider for a motion to stay: (1) Proponents’ likelihood of success on the merits, (2) the possibility of irreparable harm absent a stay; (3) the possibility of substantial injury to other parties if a stay is issued; and (4) the public interest.

      Since this was obviously prepared before knowing exactly what the decision will say, they’ve basically touched all the bases in arguing the first question–that of the likelihood of success on the merits–e.g., if it’s determined the fundamental right to marry includes marriage to a person of the same sex, or that gays & lesbians are a suspect or quasi-suspect class, if the ban on ss marriage is sex discrimination, etc.

      • 151. Aya  |  August 4, 2010 at 8:05 am

        Wow, this brought me back to my remedies class days of law school. :)

        Surely, though, they can’t really argue 2) very well, correct? No one’s going to get hurt absent a stay. Even 4) seems a little weak, whereas 3) would harm people who want to get married and are still unable to.

        There’s my 8a.m. shoddy legal analysis for you.

      • 152. Kathleen  |  August 4, 2010 at 9:37 am

        When and where was law school for you? Me – it was 15 years ago at UCLA. Following this case has motivated me to review a lot of what I learned and reminded me how really weak I am in the area of procedure.

      • 153. Ann S.  |  August 4, 2010 at 10:01 am

        I learned more about equal protection law from this trial than I ever learned in law school. Nothing like an issue of keen interest to waken the intellect.

        A little bit like Dr. Johnson’s famous quote: The prospect of hanging concentrates the mind wonderfully.

  • 154. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:52 pm

    Proponents’ Motion to Shorten Time w/2 attachements

    • 155. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:05 pm

      That link is still “processing”, whatever that means. What is a “Motion to Shorten Time?”

      • 156. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:15 pm

        There were a number of documents in the queue ahead of these at Scribd. Keep checking.

        I haven’t read it yet.- trying to catch up with news.

      • 157. Jeff  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:17 pm

        The link is working for me now. Basically they are arguing against the stay if the court should overturn prop 8:)

      • 158. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:20 pm

        @Jeff — this is a motion filed by Proponents. I’ll read it and get back here.

      • 159. Jeff  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:26 pm

        Thanks Kathleen – I totally miss read that in my excitement!:)

    • 160. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:33 pm

      This “Motion to Shorten Time” is Proponents’ request that Walker make his decision on whether or not to stay the ruling at the same time he issues the decision. The normal course of events would have the matter come up on the next available court date – which would be at least 35 days from now. Proponents say that waiting until then could mean another window of opportunity in which same sex marriages could occur. (which they argue, predictably, would be a bad, bad thing).

      Of interest, is the claim that if no stay is issued, marriages could take place immediately following the decision. Remember the question we had about the 14-day automatic stay that happened in the DOMA cases? This would suggest that no such rule apples here.

      • 161. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:19 pm

        I’ve always wondered why a judge would issue a stay on his own ruling…

      • 162. Mouse  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:51 pm

        While another window of legal same-sex marriage doesn’t cause harm to society, it certainly does harm the case of the bigots who cry about how us getting married brings down all civilization.

        Many of us got married, and life goes on. The world didn’t end. Society didn’t collapse. No one else’s marriages were impacted.

  • 163. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:54 pm

    This NOTICE from the court:

    “The Perry order will be e-filed between 1 pm and 3 pm tomorrow. It will be available electronically to the public not only through PACER but also directly from the court’s website, , free of charge soon after it is e-filed.”

  • 164. Sagesse  |  August 3, 2010 at 6:57 pm

    Many fingers and toes crossed.

  • 165. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:02 pm

    Haven’t read everything yet, so apologies if this has already been mentioned – in Eden’s post, there is a slight error.

    To pass strict scrutiny, a law must be for a compelling state interest (“important” applies to intermediate scrutiny).

  • 166. Straight Ally #3008  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:08 pm

    WOW the rallies went up fast. Anyone in Boston?

  • 167. Straight Ally #3008  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:11 pm

    Keeping the songs going….

  • 168. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:13 pm

    Finally! And here is my contribution to this celebration; or at least, my first contribution.–41179761

    • 170. Santa Barbara Mom  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:59 pm

      Wow, Richard. I was able to hold in my tears (happy tears of anticipation) until I listened to that song. How beautiful. Hope the announcement comes before my dental appointment at 2:30 ~ otherwise, OMG, how am I supposed to sit still! LOL

  • 171. Ronnie  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:19 pm

    No see this is what we need from our Straight Ally & Goddess….Kylie Minogue…singing “Somewhere Over the Rainbow”….<3…Ronnie:

  • 172. Greg in OZ  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:37 pm

    Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy!!!!!

    Here I am in Oz and I can feel the excitement from here!!!!!

    Good luck for you all tomorrow – I just know it’s gonna come down our way – but the suspense is going to KILL ME!!!!

    At least I can get up first thing in the morning to get the result – for once I done mind the time difference!

    Love all you guys and good luck again!!

    greg in Oz

  • 173. The Reverend Canon Susan Russell  |  August 3, 2010 at 7:59 pm

    Apologies if this is a repeat … things are moving fast this evening! Want to get word out about:

    The “Community Prayer for Social Justice Rally” –a Los Angeles Rally and Community Response to Prop. 8 Ruling

    Members of Latino, Asian/Pacific-Islander, African-American, Middle-Eastern, LGBT and other communities will gather to show their solidarity for social justice after the District Court announces its decision on Proposition 8, the California legislation that bans marriage between same-sex couples.

    When: August 4, 2010, 8 pm – 10 pm

    Where: Olvera Street, across the street from Union Station. Take the Metro to Union Station,
    Media van parking off Los Angeles Street from Alameda.


    JOIN US!

    • 174. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:15 pm

      Hello Rev Russell – thank you so much for reminding me of this event. And I’m so glad it’s planned this for later in the evening. This means we can go celebrate in WeHo and then join you downtown on our way home.

      I look forward to seeing you.

  • 175. Ray in MA  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:11 pm

    I’m without words…I only have tears of anxious anticipation.

    • 176. Ray in MA  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:15 pm

      This is it Pamzee… THIS IS IT!

  • 177. Sagesse  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:20 pm

    Pause. Deep breath. Imagining all the crowds all over CA and the US, wearing their pride. Celebrating (please, please, please) or defiant.

    Want to gather in large numbers and get right up in their face…. have at it :).

    Imagining Brian and Louis on a bus to St Louis MO, reading the decision and preparing to spew fire and brimstone and righteous indignation at 50 codgers in a parking lot.

  • 178. Ray in MA  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:21 pm

    Pam, just remembered you’re in FL… crazy timing, huh? Hope you’re doin’ OK with the goings on down there.

  • 179. Mark M  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:25 pm

    I am over the moon excited!!!!

    • 180. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:31 pm

      This is one of those time that I wish the P8TT site had the capability for us to cam with each other. I would love to see the looks on all your faces right now, and to let any of you who have not seen the picture on FB to see BZ. Wait a minute. Let me see if I can embed the picture in my next comment from my computer.

      • 181. Mark M  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:35 pm

        Big hugs and much love Richard!!

      • 182. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:48 pm

        Same to you, Mark. Look me up on FB. And I am thinking that is how I will have to get the picture over here is by posting the FB link, since I can’t seem to do a copy and paste from my computer or an upload here.

      • 183. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:04 pm

        Richard, you need to upload the picture to a photo host and then post the link here.

        Both flickr and Photobucket are free photo hosting sites. I’m sure there are others, too.

      • 184. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:05 pm

        Richard, I’m not thinking very clearly — if you can’t figure out how to upload to photo to a host, send it to me as an email attachment, and I’ll upload it to my host and post here.

      • 185. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:19 pm

        Thanks, Kathleen. I will do that. Watch your email.

      • 186. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 11:11 pm

        Here’s Richard’s picture. He can give you the commentary.

      • 187. Ronnie  |  August 3, 2010 at 11:16 pm

        hehehe…I see a Disco Ball in the background…I LOVE IT!!!


      • 188. Dpeck  |  August 3, 2010 at 11:17 pm

        HI Richard!! : )

      • 189. Mark M  |  August 4, 2010 at 6:42 am

        Great pic Rich!
        You two make a sweet couple

      • 190. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 4, 2010 at 10:36 am

        Thanks. Glad everybody likes the picture. Yes, Ronnie, there is a disco ball in the background. We have that one, a small rainbow one, another motorized one that is just a little smaller than the one in the living room, one that is on a cone stand, and two fog machines. Of course this picture was taken before I grew my beard, and was part of my entry into a dream wedding contest summer of ’09. We didn’t win, but at least we were able to enter and they didn’t tell us we were ineligible.

  • 191. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:26 pm

    Is anyone here going to be at the event in WeHo or downtown Los Angeles?

  • 192. omini  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:29 pm

    Hello all, first i want to thank all the folks working at the trial tracker and the NOM tracker for their work.

    Second, i need some advice as to going to the court house in SF tomorrow for the verdict. Im pretty young (going to be a junior in highschool though!) and my parents are unsure of the safety of me and a couple of friends going alone. They think it might get too rowdy and become unsafe for us, but im sure that there will be a substantial police presence at tbe court house to keep things in line. I’ve seen video from past rallies and its looked fine. Can i get some advice to sway my parents to let me go (or sway me to not go, if it really is unsafe)? When i’ve grown up and have a family, i want to be able to tell my kids that i was there, that i watched as history was made before my eyes, that i was a part of it.

    Thanks again everyone! Please respond fast, we only have 16 1/2 hours until the verdict is out, and i want to be there!

    • 193. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:44 pm

      What about your folks going with you, just to be sure? I am guessing that the more, the merrier.

    • 194. Mark M  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:51 pm

      Omini you just brought tears to my eyes.
      Tell your parents to try and relax and trust you…you have the chance to be part of history.
      You will be surrounded by like minded people in a safe secure environment. I am SO jealous!!
      Good luck with your parents!!

    • 195. Felyx  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:57 pm


      Follow all the standard measures. Tell them where, when, how, how long and with whom.

      Obtain a cell phone with you so that you can call them at regular intervals (whatever they feel is good) and so that they can call you.

      Go in a group. Strength in numbers and all.

      Remind them you want to maintain your safety as much as they would want… (basically I am a responsible person.)

      After all this (and whatever else you think of,) ask them where they were when Kennedy was shot. Then tell them you where you want to be on what might be the most significant national event of your life!

      Good Luck!


    • 196. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:14 pm

      Omni, my bet is this is going to be a giant celebration. See if your parents will go with you, sure. But I think you and your friends will be fine! As has been suggested, take a cell phone, promise to check in with your parents on a regular basis (and follow through!). If I were in San Francisco, I’d offer to talk to your parents and promise to accompany you.

      This is history!! I sure hope you can go. And then come back here and tell us what it was like for you.

    • 197. Ann S.  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:15 pm

      @Omini, you’ll be fine. Use common sense about engaging any opponents and, as always, try to stay away from anyone who makes you uncomfortable. And stay together with your friends.

    • 198. Dpeck  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:40 pm

      Hi Omini,

      You’re getting lots of good advice here. It’s smart of you to ask about the safety issue, but there’s really nothing to worry about. I’ve been to many rallies and demonstrations in SF, most of which either start or end at the City Hall / courthouse plaza and there’s never been a problem. It’s always been a good experience, even when we were angry about something (like when Prop 8 passed in 2008).

      But keep in mind that although the ruling will be announced between 1PM and 3PM, the main planned event starts at 5 PM and it will start at the corner of Market and Castro at the huge rainbow flag. You can get there by taking the underground MUNI train to Castro Station. The crowd will then proceed down Market to the courthouse / City hall, with a stop at the LGBT center on the way.

      You could go to the courthouse for the announcement in the afternoon and then head up Market to Castro for the 5PM start of the main event. Have a great time and say ‘hi’ to any of us that you see there!

    • 199. Alan E.  |  August 4, 2010 at 8:48 am

      Omini, come find me if you go to the rally. I’ll be holding a sign that says “Lesbians Love Boies” on it. Hope you enjoy the press conference at the federal building today!

  • 200. Tim in Sonoma  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:38 pm

    I’m running in circles!!
    I’m SO EXCITED and So scared at the same time!
    I Love all of you!!!
    We stuck this out for a reason!! And we deserve to win this!!
    I have to go to bed but will not be able to sleep!!!
    Happy August 4th!!! I HOPE!!
    Oh, and happy birthday to my brother Jack.
    WHOO HOO!!!

  • 201. Bob  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:44 pm

    Hi Omini, welcome to the excitement, I’m no where near S.F. so one suggestion would be to get one of your parents to go with you, just a thought

    otherwise, hang in here , and repost, maybe someone going to one of the events will invite you to go along.

    you want to be right in the crowd not just reading it from the web. good luck

  • 202. erasure25  |  August 3, 2010 at 8:55 pm

    Just read the news and now I’ve seriously got a swarm of butterflies in my stomach. I’m hopeful and I want to believe that Judge Walker can see through the charade of nonsense, irrationality, and animosity from the defense, but you never know… I too am wondering on what level he makes his decision (rational basis? strict scrutiny?) and if the recent DOMA ruling had any effect…

  • 203. Bryan  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:00 pm

    I can’t get to SF but I’m gonna be in San Jose/Saratoga. I’m heading to the college early morning or so to talk to them about a Stafford Loan (because there’s no other time this week) but I’ll be home by Noon, maybe I can try to catch something here in SJ, I know I want to be someplace special when history is made. I was at the college both when the beginnings of the vote happened and when the first court case lost (the latter being my last day of classes, ironically)

    • 204. fiona64  |  August 4, 2010 at 8:50 am

      Hi, Brian. There is a rally tonight at 6 PM, at the Billy deFrank GLBT Community Center.

      I hope to be there myself, but much depends on my day at the office.


  • 205. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:04 pm

    NOM hasn’t posted any of this on either their nation for marriage site or their marriage tour site.

    I don’t think I will be sleeping much tonight…so I will wonder around the world wide web and see who is and who isn’t discussing tomorrow’s decision.

    I pray for all my fellow marriage equality supporters!

    • 206. Ronnie  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:13 pm

      They’ve gone all “lets pray” & the word is going to end on NOM’s little sub hate & violence advocating Facebook page “Protect Marriage: One Man One Woman that NOM doesn’t want to admit being affiliated with even though they have a tab asking for membership etc etc…..Oh & Louis is one of the admins…not affiliated my @$$…..HI LOUIS!!!!!


      • 207. Straight Ally #3008  |  August 4, 2010 at 3:45 am

        *reads some of the posts*

        (Yoda voice)

        “Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering. I sense much fear in you.”

  • 208. Anonygrl  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:12 pm

    It is now after midnight here on the east coast. I am going to go outside and take a look to see if I can see any of the lights in the sky from those giant solar flares headed our way. Even if I can’t I am going to take it as a sign that even the universe is with us in our excitement, and holding its breath too.

    Then I am going to try and get some sleep. Goodnight all, and sweet dreams for those who can sleep. I wait in wonder with all of you as these events unfold and this world we live in becomes a better place.

    Love wins out over hate in the end, every single time.

  • 209. ralzma  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:24 pm

    *Crosses fingers*

    Though, really, after using this wonderful place to read the transcripts, I doubt the ruling will be against marriage equality.

  • 210. Tim in Sonoma  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:29 pm

    I will be in San Francisco tomorrow for the virdict with some friends! I will check back in the morning and see if any of you are going. Lets Meet!! Im on the P8TT face book page as well. Tim E. Church

  • 211. Tim in Sonoma  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:31 pm

    I WILL be carrying an AMERICAN flag!

  • 212. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:36 pm

    Don’t forget that the people who brought us the trial reenactments will be live webcasting a reading of the decision w/in one hour of the decision’s release. You can sign up for an automatic notification of the webcast at their site:

    • 213. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:44 pm

      Thanks Kathleen. I am signed up and bookmarked…now for those hours to creep by

  • 214. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:44 pm

    Is anything going on here in Vegas? Does anyone know? I’m working till 11:30 tomorrow night, but the party never stops here. If there’s a party (hopefully) or a demonstration (hopefully not), I’d love to grab my hubby and be there!

    • 215. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:16 pm

      I don’t see anything listed here:

      You could contact your local LGBT advocacy group and see if they have anything planned. It may not be on their radar yet.

      • 216. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:30 pm

        Likely it’s not, Kathleen. Ever since I’ve moved to Vegas, I’ve felt like I lived in a foreign country…

        I can just show up at Krave after work, I suppose.

      • 217. Dpeck  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:43 pm

        HI JOEL!!

        I’ll be in SF tomorrow for the big event and I’ll be thinking of you guys!!!

        DaveP / DPeck : )

  • 218. Elliott  |  August 3, 2010 at 9:52 pm

    I can’t believe it… finally! I’ve worn out the refresh keys on my computer during the last few months wanting every minute for this announcement and now I’m filled with butterflies. Thank you to all the posters (civilian and from the Courage Campaign) for keeping me occupied during the last few months. Now I know how Paris and Lindsay must have felt just waiting for the time to pass.

    Keeping my fingers crossed and sending much love to my brothers and sisters united,


  • 219. Ann S.  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:19 pm

    Another announcement, and it has a picture of my brother and BIL, as a bonus.

    • 220. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:25 pm

      They are a very handsome couple. And if I remember correctly, they were one of the first couples married after the CASC ruled that not allowing SSM was unconstitutional, weren’t they? Way to go, guys!

      • 221. Ann S.  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:30 pm

        Yes, they were. What a joyful day that was at SF City Hall. Happy couples getting married all over. Everyone in the place was beaming, even security guards and clerks.

        Women from the Unitarian Church were handing out cupcakes with a pair of Teddy Grahams on each, as wedding cake toppers.

        When a newly married couple would descend the grand staircase in the middle of City Hall, everyone else would stop what they were doing to applaud.

        Everyone should get to experience such joy.

      • 222. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:35 pm

        And thanks to everyone here at Courage Campaign, David Boies and Ted Olsen and their respective, and respectable, legal firms, all of our straight allies, Rob Reiner and Michelle Singer, AFER, CCI, and the two couples who showed such grace and courage by getting on the stand to fight for what is right, we will soon all be able to share that same joy. I want the next generation to never have to wonder whether they can get married in the local area or if they will have to go out of state. I want each couple to be able to choose not only who they will marry, but where they will marry–be it their backyard, the local skating rink, the local park, or out of state. I don’t want them to have to go out of state because they can’t get married at home. Part of the joy of getting married is being able to share it with family and friends, and every couple deserves that.

      • 223. Dpeck  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:51 pm

        Yes indeed, great thanks to all who have had a hand in getting us to this point. David Boise will be speaking in SF on Thursday evening and I plan to be there. If I have the chance I’d love to thank him, but I can’t for the life of me think of what I could say that could convey how much I appreciate what he has done for us.

  • […] we count down the hours to the decision sometime between 1-3 p.m. PST on Wednesday, check out AFER’s summary and then click the link below to read much, much more on their web […]

  • 225. Joel  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:28 pm

    Just to keep our watches synched, we are on Pacific daylight time here on the West Coast, not PST.

  • 226. omini  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:29 pm

    I talked it over with my parents, and it looks like i’ll be seeing some of you tomorrow at the court house!!!

    I am extatic right now, just knowing that we are on the eve of history, and that i will be a part of it. Thanks to every one who lent support and ideas (they really helped)! Tomorrow we make history!!!!! :D

    • 227. Ann S.  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:31 pm

      Have a joyful time, Omini!

    • 228. Dpeck  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:48 pm

      Awesome!! Have a great day! And keep checking your earlier post above for more replies – more info for you up there too.

    • 229. Kathleen  |  August 3, 2010 at 11:34 pm

      That’s great news! And, as a parent, I’d like to just put in my plug for making sure you check in at the times you’ve agreed to, if that’s part of the deal. I know how easy it is to get swept up in things, and forget. Remember they’ll be concerned about you, so be thoughtful. :)

    • 230. Straight Grandmother  |  August 4, 2010 at 1:01 am

      OMNI, I don’t knwo if this is possible, but if you could have a phone with you that takes pictures and send them pics of you at the courthouse. I pray wiht this decision and the recent DOMA decision adn the unrolling of DADT, your generation will have Equality instead of state sponsored discrimination. That is always what we older folks work for that the next generation has it better than we did.

    • 231. Mark M  |  August 4, 2010 at 6:44 am


  • 232. Franck  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:35 pm

    … excuse me, did anyone see a few heartbeats going around here? I seem to have missed several when I read this.

    – Franck P. Rabeson
    Days spent apart from my fiancé because of DOMA: 1139 days, as of today.

  • 234. James Tuttle  |  August 3, 2010 at 10:42 pm

    ALLL this time…and I can;t believe it will happen tomorrow. I’m SO excited. I don;t know what else to say.

  • 235. DK  |  August 3, 2010 at 11:04 pm

    I am a straight supporter of equal rights for all and don’t know if I can get to sleep (2 am here on the east coast), I am so nervous now! And excited! It’s been an amazing ride on this site (THANK YOU to the Courage Campaign!) to read/watch history in the making. This is shaping up to be the Brown case of my lifetime at least.
    Hugs to all!

    DK in Connecticut (happy to say my current state of residence offers marriage equality…but as a native Californian can’t wait for my home state to regain that early leadership!)

  • 236. myla seidel  |  August 3, 2010 at 11:06 pm

    If the churches has any thing to say about it it will be a no. too bad, but we shall fight again. if we win, we will be celebratig and making wedding plans.:-)

  • 237. rick jacobs  |  August 3, 2010 at 11:36 pm

    Having live-blogged the entire trial right here, I cannot imagine a ruling against us if it is based on evidence and argument alone. The other side should have stayed home, just like those on the NOM Tour.

    But anything could happen. Remember, we have already won a huge victory. When the other side says in federal court, “Your Honor, we don’t need any evidence”, you know they are done. It’s just a matter of time.

    Together, we’ll win and we’ll change the country’s understanding of why victory is in the interest of a stronger America.


    • 238. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 3, 2010 at 11:43 pm

      I really don’t see us losing. But, anything can happen. None of us knows precisely what Judge Walker thought during the trial…but we at least don’t have long to wait. It was great to be a part of this history and I, like Richard Walter, want to thank everyone for letting us have our voice here. This is only part of Phase I of marriage equality…I plan to be here for the long run through victory of marriage equality for all americans.

  • 239. Greg in Oz  |  August 4, 2010 at 2:14 am

    Hey Guys – anyone still up? (I’m posting this in two threads – just to see who’s around :-))

    It’s 7.00pm here in Oz – too early in the morning for the USA guys – but I know there’s a few international people here like myself that might still be around.

    I’ve got a question for you all (inclusive of STr8 Grandma – I LOVE you & your posts!!) – what do you think this ruling (which HAS to go our way) will do for GLBTI rights in your country? Will it have an effect? Are you the issues in your country the same as those in the USA (Oz is in some ways ahead of the USA and in other ways behind).

    I’m just curious, as this whole trial hasn’t really made much of an impact here in Australia, due to aforementioned already achieved rights, but I knoww that in some countries, this ruling could be seen as a bit of a ‘tipping point’ in the whole GLBTI area.

    I’d like to know what the international folk here think how the Prop 8 ruling will affect them. Just a thought that I’ve had for a while

    Greg in Oz

  • 240. Alan E.  |  August 4, 2010 at 6:55 am

    I woke up this morning, and the clock from 24 was ticking in my head. I am excited and nervous and anxious and joyful all at the same time, but I must keep it a little suppressed just so I can make it to 1–3 pm!!!

    I want to reiterate that I want to meet any and all Trackers who will be in the Castro of San Francisco. I’ll be holding a sign that says Lesbians Love Boies on one side and Gays Love Boies on the other. I will be wearing THIS SHIRT and a black jacket if it is too cold (yes, too cold in California in August). Come find me and say hi! If there are enough people gathered at one time, I would love to get a group picture. =)

    • 241. Felyx  |  August 4, 2010 at 7:02 am

      Consider changing your sign to Gay Boys Love Boies!

      Sounds cooler!


      • 242. Alan E.  |  August 4, 2010 at 8:24 am

        I thought about it, but it just didn’t balance well. I spent about 30 minutes going back and forth about what the “gays” side should say.

  • 243. Alan E.  |  August 4, 2010 at 8:26 am

    This song made me feel really good this morning:

  • 244. john  |  August 4, 2010 at 9:16 am

    Can’t wait to hear the decision. Meanwhile, yesterday at Lowe’s front door a man with a card table petitioned customers to sign “against Obama’s Health Care”. Management did not tell him to leave but told me I could NOT petition for gay marriage. He admitted that he was being paid.

  • 245. her.wife  |  August 4, 2010 at 10:27 am

    we can do this love …love

  • […] what are we looking for today? How do we win? How do we lose? And what defines a win? Well, I said yesterday that I’m optimistic, but there’s more than one way to skin the cat here. So, let’s just go through them, […]


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