Newsweek paints Brian Brown’s portrait; we fill in a few holes

November 15, 2010 at 3:51 pm 84 comments

Cross-posted at Good As You.

By Jeremy Hooper

There is lots to chew on in Newsweek‘s new, slightly fluffy piece on the National Organization For Marriage‘s Brian Brown. For the sake of time and length, we’ll focus on just a few.

(1) This subtitle:

Brian Brown is leading the fight against gay marriage. And succeeding.

Okay, no. Because while yea, there have been setbacks at polls, the reality is that when Brian Brown came into the marriage fight in the early 2000s, there were zero states with legal marriage equality for same-sex couples. There are now five such states, as well as the District of Columbia — all of which NOM tried to stop. One of which, Connecticut, was Brian’s sole focus for a number of years. And even of the two states that NOM can count out as all-out wins, Maine and California: One of them, California, is now playing out in a landmark court battle that currently has the pro-equality side at a great, historic advantage (with even many in the anti-gay marriage movement admitting that their side has crummy defense arguments).

So the idea that Brian is “succeeding”? Well when I, a gay man, look down at the legally-recognized ring on my hand, I have an teensy bit of trouble seeing Brian’s fight to eliminate marriage for same-sex couples in that same light.

(2) The Newsweek piece begins with this setup:

Brian Brown’s hate mail is divided into two categories: messages that go straight to the police and those he dumps into a growing computer file labeled OPPOSITION. One riled caller threatened to hang him from a tree “and burn you while your children watch”; someone else sent an e-mail offering to “donate” a pipe bomb to his office. The majority, however, simply vent frustration at Brown, who has emerged as the nation’s fiercest crusader against gay marriage.

Not sure if Brian purposely steered the reporter, Eve Conant, in this direction, or if Ms. Conant developed this framework on her own. But this initial paragraph feels misleading, at best. Because all of us — ALL OF US! — who engage in this so-called “culture war” experience harsh scrutiny, lumps, and sometimes even threats. I have. Often. Some of them I’ve made public, some I’ve deleted and moved on, and some I’ve turned over to authorities. Or when Brian’s fellow “culture warriors” like Peter LaBarbera (who has used Brian as a source on multiple occasions) lift my wedding photo and publicly post it with the word “perversion” on it (something Peter’s done twice in the past month), I’ve taken the high road and turned it into a silly blog post.

The bottom line: Neither “side” can fairly use this supposed “hate mail” to garner one-sided sympathy. And in fact, if there were to be “winner take all” matchup between the history of persecution that the two viewpoints have faced in modern America, with the loser agreeing to shut up for good, I’m pretty certain the anti-gay side would be advised to sit out that challenge!

(3) The article credits this line as a NOM “success”:

His National Organization for Marriage played a key role in financing the Nov. 2 ouster of three Iowa Supreme Court justices who ruled to legalize same-sex marriage there in 2009.

It’s quite unfortunate to see the mainstream media biting down on this line, full bait. Because yes, NOM put huge effort into ousting these judges. But the retention vote was not a marriage vote. It wasn’t a single issue vote. It shouldn’t ever be a single issue vote. By design! So a mainstream news publication like Newsweek should not buy into the idea that it was a marriage vote. And in fact, these same publications should be asking tough questions of those who turned one state’s local vote into a de facto campaign against marriage nationwide! That’s the real story from the Iowa vote: The dangerous idea that voters should vote out jurists on the basis of vindictive, largely faith-based whims, without ever being encouraged to look at the individual’s career (or to even fully chew on the one opinion in question).

The Iowa For Freedom campaign was intellectually reductive from the beginning. By its blueprint, it was meant to enter the realm of anti-equality PR. The media does not have to buy what they are selling.

(4) This portrait of Brian’s political engagement:

Brown would make a good politician. An Oxford graduate, he’s extremely polished, the kind of campaign leader who sticks faithfully to such benign-sounding talking points as “good-hearted people can have ideas that are profoundly wrong.” He mostly tries to avoid demonizing gays and lesbians: NOM ads invoke Martin Luther King Jr., the right to free speech, and the right to vote, not quotes from Leviticus. “Emotions run high on this issue, and people can be vitriolic. I never have to worry about that with Brian,” says Kevin Smith of Cornerstone Action, a nonprofit group working with Brown to overturn gay marriage in New Hampshire.

We saw this whole “Brian doesn’t talk nasty about gays” meme back when the Washington Post ran their 8/09 fluff piece on the NOM head. And no, this writer has admittedly never heard Brian cite Leviticus. But who the hell cares about that one, convenient, biblical sidestep?! Because I have heard him refer to my marriage as “based on lies about human nature.” As “madness.” As “ripp[ing] a significant hole in the fabric of…society.” As going against “God’s truth about marriage.” As a “civil wrong.” And perhaps the most offensive of all: I routinely hear Brian trying to flip the script so that the gay couples who are simply fighting for an equal slice of pie are made out to be the “bullies” whose arguments are limited to “character assassination.” So Leviticus, Schemiticus — Brian does, in fact, paint gays as threatening, and our unions as ungodly!

Oh, and NOM’s very first public act as an organization? It was this:

Yup, that’s right: Comparing a local lawmaker to Judas and Benedict Arnold, and posting it over a highway for everyone to see. You know: Good-hearted stuff like that.

Oh, and as for Kevin Smith and his worries about others: Perhaps he should worry more about the way his own blog posts cite a designated hate group as a credible source of marital information!

(5) This assessment from his wife:

“Suddenly it became everything we talked about—almost overnight, it seemed,” recalls his wife, Susan, who married him in 1999 and is home-schooling their six children, with a seventh on the way. Susan also opposes gay marriage, but—perhaps like many who share her views—doesn’t like to be public about it, often wishing she could tell people her husband is a lawyer or doctor and leave it at that. At an event in Providence, R.I., she says, “they walked up to my kids and asked them, ‘Is Mommy raising you to be a good little bigot?’?” Yet she says she understands the frustration behind those remarks. “They believe in this as deeply as we do,” she says. “I see why we’d get under their skin.”

First off: It’s just weird. There’s no way around it. There’s no softer way to say it. There’s really no need to expend greater intellectual capital on it. A heterosexual man’s near-daily, decade-long obsession with same-sex marriage is Brina-Brownjust plain bizarre. Then’s when you combine the obsession with an educated man’s ability to discredit the plethora of common sense civil data that sides with *civil* marriage equality? It’s weird with a capital Whaaaa?!

But as for his wife’s take on our fight: What she doesn’t see (or at least doesn’t admit) is that there should not be a war between who “believes” in this more deeply. There shouldn’t be a side that’s getting under gay tax-payers’ skin. Because in truth, there’s one set of American citizens who say that under our shared constitution, same-sex couples have more than met the test to have their adult, two-partner marriages fully recognized under civil law. The seeking of benign civil peace is the organic concept at play here. The resistance movement, of which Brian and Susan are both a part, is a complete contrivance. There’s is a discriminatory roadblock that, along with the help of all-too-prevalent heterosexism and too much media complacency, has been able to shape antagonism into a viable political movement.

It’s of course understandable why Susan would take this stance of seeing her husband’s work as mere political action, as if he’s lobbying for tort reform or Medicaid. But that anecdotal justification is only going to go so far.

(6) The Newsweek piece ends exactly as it began: With a quip about Brian getting hate mail. So okay, fine, since they insist: Let’s play this game:

(email sent to G-A-Y)

Picture 6-167-2

Yup — gets under our skin, indeed, Ms. Brown.

*FULL ARTICLE: ‘I Do’? I Don’t! [Newsweek]

Entry filed under: NOM Exposed, Right-wing.

Do or die time on #DADT: Courage Campaign and HRC pushing Senate to bring repeal to a vote before lame-duck session ends Latter-day revisionism: Church allies hope memory banks are as easy to steal as wedding rings

84 Comments Add your own

  • 1. Lesbians Love Boies  |  November 15, 2010 at 3:53 pm

    Subscribe now to read later.

    Reply
    • 2. Ronnie  |  November 15, 2010 at 3:59 pm

      same….<3…Ronnie

      Reply
    • 3. JonT  |  November 15, 2010 at 5:38 pm

      Reading now to subscribe later.

      Oh, wait :)

      I’m thinking that with 7 (!) kids, the odds are that at least one of them will be gay.

      Wonder how that will play out later in his life.

      And as for hate mail – I wonder if he’s ever read the DailyKos’ weekly ‘Saturday hate mail-a-palooza’.

      Here’s last Saturdays: http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2010/11/6/918109/-Saturday-hate-mail-a-palooza

      Warning: It’s not pretty, and it was actually fairly tame compared to the previous Saturday.

      I wonder how those particular people feel about gay rights? Religion? Uh huh.

      Sorry BSB – I do not buy into your victimhood schtick. And you are on the wrong side of history. My only hope is that you will live long enough to fully understand that.

      Reply
  • 4. Michelle Evans  |  November 15, 2010 at 3:54 pm

    I want to cross post the info here:

    I would like to post information about an event that will be happening here in Orange County (CA) this coming Saturday at 6:00 pm. It is our local Transgender Day of Remembrance, and will be held at The Center OC, 1605 N. Spurgeon, Santa Ana. Cherie and I will be amongst the speakers who will be talking about being trans and specifically about those in our community who have been murdered over the past year.

    I would invite my friends from the P8TT group to come join us if you are in the local area, and if not, there are events all across the nation and world. You can see more about the events, and find a local one, through the site at:

    http://www.transgenderdor.org/

    And here is a link to my own web site with info about last years event:

    http://www.mach25media.com/tdor09.html

    If anyone here needs any more info, please let me know.

    Reply
    • 5. Kathleen  |  November 15, 2010 at 4:35 pm

      Thank you, Michelle, for letting us know about this event. I will try to make it and hope to meet you and you Cherie.

      Reply
      • 6. Michelle Evans  |  November 15, 2010 at 10:35 pm

        Kathleen,

        Hope you can make it. Looking forward to getting to meet you Saturday. That will definitely make my day. :-)

        Reply
        • 7. Kathleen  |  November 15, 2010 at 10:38 pm

          Likewise. :)

          Reply
        • 8. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 17, 2010 at 6:49 am

          @ Michelle / Kathleen – hope you report on event : )

          Reply
    • 9. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 15, 2010 at 5:26 pm

      @ Michelle
      Darn! I checked out events in Salt Lake City and notice I just missed Shannon Minter by 2 days : /

      http://qsaltlake.com/2010/10/28/center-to-observe-transgender-pride-month/

      Nonetheless, I salute and celebrate you Michelle and all others like you : ) Love, Gregory

      Reply
  • 10. Ann S.  |  November 15, 2010 at 4:11 pm

    Brian Brown may have won a couple of battles, but he’s going to lose the war.

    Reply
    • 11. Mouse  |  November 15, 2010 at 5:11 pm

      And he’s likely to lose his marriage.

      Reply
  • 12. Alan E.  |  November 15, 2010 at 4:16 pm

    I forced myself to read the whole article this morning. It was tough, but thank you for tearing it apart and filling in the wholes. Unfortunately, there are many more holes left to be filled.

    PS I love the “Brian” brown crayon.

    Reply
  • 13. Michelle Evans  |  November 15, 2010 at 4:33 pm

    After the puff piece on ex-gays on Nightline last week, and now this, wouldn’t it be nice if mainstream media were to run an article or news story actually against these jerks and in favor of marriage equality. NOM, FRC, whomever, are all getting way too much positive press. It would be a nice change.

    This is what I often talk about that when two people have differing opinions about something, the truth does not always lay somewhere in the middle. There can be a right and a wrong. Period. NOM and Brian, and all the others are simply wrong. There is no right way to discriminate against a human being.

    Reply
    • 14. Steve  |  November 15, 2010 at 4:38 pm

      But then who would they go to when they need a token soundbite to provide a “balanced point of view” in LGBT articles?

      Reply
    • 15. Mouse  |  November 15, 2010 at 5:13 pm

      Obviously, Courage Campaign and HRC aren’t paying enough advertising dollars to these “News” media.

      Reply
  • 16. aaron in san fran  |  November 15, 2010 at 4:40 pm

    don’t these people always say that the media is against them and for the “GLBT liberals”? what crap!

    Reply
  • 17. Richard A. Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan)  |  November 15, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    Isn’t Newsweek part of Rupert Murdoch’s organization that loves to twist the news in such a way as to fire up the radical Paulinists?

    Reply
  • 18. John B.  |  November 15, 2010 at 5:22 pm

    Yes, NOM keeps patting themselves on the backs for their “successes” but they don’t like to talk much about their failures, do they? Let’s not forget that in Washington, DC NOM and their allies fought against same-sex marriage (heck, Brian Brown personally testified against it in a DC Council hearing on the subject) and opposed several DC council members who supported same-sex marriage, all of whom were re-elected. (In fact our new mayor is one of those council members.) In fact they couldn’t even get one of the candidates they endorsed and supported (Delano Hunter) elected in the primary despite the fact that he was endorsed by the Washington Post (!) and the incumbent is not particularly popular.

    Reply
  • 19. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 15, 2010 at 5:28 pm

    A heterosexual man’s near-daily, decade-long obsession with same-sex marriage is just plain bizarre.

    AROOOOOOOOGA!!! AROOOOOOOOGA!!!

    Reply
    • 20. Tomato  |  November 15, 2010 at 8:23 pm

      Closet case. Every time I see a picture of him, the gaydar goes off. Arooooooooga!!!! Arooooooooga!!!! indeed!

      How many babies does he need to plant in that woman before his manhood feels assured? And she’s homeschooling them alone? Didn’t a Paulinist extremeist already try that once, and his wife cracked and killed all 5 of their kids?

      Dear Brian – be a real man, and keep it in your pants. Save your wife from your desperate ego, save the sperm for your own hand.

      Reply
  • 21. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 15, 2010 at 5:37 pm

    Thank you Jeremy for article. I suspect you inspired at least a few here to contact Newsweek! I’m grateful for the internet that helps shed light on the Brian Brown’s and Chris Krok’s of the world.

    Reply
  • 22. Sagesse  |  November 15, 2010 at 5:37 pm

    Haven’t read the Newsweek article, but as a counterbalance, here’s Alvin McEwan very effetively taking on Paul Cameron.

    Paul Cameron : ‘ Prop 8 trial was lost because supporters were scared to use my work’

    http://holybulliesandheadlessmonsters.blogspot.com/2010/11/paul-cameron-prop-8-trial-was-lost.html

    Reply
  • 23. Lesbians Love Boies  |  November 15, 2010 at 6:07 pm

    I wonder what Brian Brown thinks of when he’s being screened at the airports. He’s so homophobic, I bet he requests a female screener!

    Reply
    • 24. Tomato  |  November 15, 2010 at 8:25 pm

      He yearns for male contact, that’s why he’s so obsessed with gay sex and gay marriage. TSA screenings are probably grand for him, though he would loudly protest in order to hide his pleasure.

      Reply
      • 25. Bill  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:02 pm

        I heard he approaches the TSA agents, pants open, full boner standing proudly.

        Reply
  • 26. Lesbians Love Boies  |  November 15, 2010 at 6:34 pm

    I love the comments on the Newsweek site. 99.9% in favor of marriage equality.

    Reply
    • 27. Sagesse  |  November 15, 2010 at 7:25 pm

      Read the comments, all. They will soothe your soul. What does it say to, or about, Newsweek that its readers see right through Brian Brown and his cause?

      Reply
      • 28. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 15, 2010 at 7:48 pm

        Thank you for pointing the comments out! Yay! : )

        Reply
  • 29. Alicia  |  November 15, 2010 at 7:00 pm

    I’m extremely angry with the tone of this article. I’m going to be writing to Newsweek

    Reply
  • 30. Ginger  |  November 15, 2010 at 7:51 pm

    Lesbian Students stopped from Graduating

    http://www.advocate.com/News/Daily_News/2010/11/15/Lesbian_Students_Stopped_from_Graduating/

    Q: So what do you do when the bullying comes from the principle instead of fellow students?
    A: Cause a shit-storm and try to get him fired.

    Reply
  • 31. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 15, 2010 at 9:58 pm

    How does Newsweek go from Ted Olson’s “The Conservative Case for Gay Marriage” to this? This feels like another case of presenting “both sides” even if one side is rubbish.

    Reply
  • 32. Chris B  |  November 16, 2010 at 3:28 am

    Wow. Poor Brian Brown and those threatening e-mails. I feel bad for him. Because no gay person has ever received threatening e-mails, or been threatened with physical violence, or actual violence, or actual death–just for being an outspoken gay person, or even just a private gay person.

    I don’t understand the part in this article about the Iowa judges vote. As I see it (with my limited knowledge) it was the ONLY win for NOM that can actually be attributed directly to NOM. I mean if it weren’t for the gay marriage issue, would anyone have really cared about the retention vote? NOM made it an issue.

    I would give them credit for the Iowa judges vote. All the other NOM wins this year could probably be attributed to the anti-democrat feeling this year. Let’s remember that only 1/3 of NOM-back candidates won this year. Not a great record.

    Reply
  • 33. grod  |  November 16, 2010 at 4:09 am

    Two Hours for Prop 8 arguments
    http://legalpad.typepad.com/my_weblog/2010/11/circuit-sets-two-hour-prop-8-argument.html

    Reply
  • 35. Sagesse  |  November 16, 2010 at 5:03 am

    Not quite ‘It Gets Better’

    David Hyde Pierce Talks Coming Out & Marriage

    http://www.popeater.com/2010/11/15/david-hyde-pierce-gay-marriage/

    Reply
  • 36. Sagesse  |  November 16, 2010 at 5:11 am

    Brian Brown will be all over this one, if it is overturned

    Wedding announcement costs gay woman job at Benedictine

    http://www.sj-r.com/top-stories/x1109354817/Newspaper-wedding-announcement-costs-gay-woman-her-job-at-Benedictine-University

    Reply
    • 37. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 8:57 am

      @ Sagesse

      …glad this stuff gets exposed….tx for posting

      yea, Brian the Catholic would appreciated this story …

      Reply
      • 38. Sheryl, Mormon Mother of a wonderful son who just happens to be gay  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:12 pm

        I hope they do sue and win.

        Sheryl, Mormon Mother

        Reply
        • 39. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:38 pm

          Ditto! (Hi SMM!)

          Reply
  • […] Newsweek paints Brian Brown’s portrait; w&#1077 fill &#1110n a few holes « Prop 8 Trial … Tags: marriage movement, sake […]

    Reply
  • 41. JdW  |  November 16, 2010 at 7:56 am

    If you want to know the true nature of vitriolic hatred towards gay people and those who support their desires for full equality, read the unmoderated comments on a site like Yahoo! News.

    Reply
    • 42. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 9:53 am

      no thanks! I’ll take your word for it!

      Reply
      • 43. Kathleen  |  November 16, 2010 at 9:58 am

        Same here, Gregory. :)

        Reply
        • 44. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 10:15 am

          Hi Kathleen! ((HUGS!))

          Reply
        • 45. Kathleen  |  November 16, 2010 at 10:20 am

          Hugs to you too. :)

          Reply
  • 46. Bill  |  November 16, 2010 at 11:17 am

    Here’s the latest from Brian Brown’s dear friend Peter LaBarbera.

    A new low. Even for him.

    http://www.christiannewswire.com/news/3927915508.html

    Reply
    • 47. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 11:46 am

      @ Bill
      This article actually made me laugh out loud! **shaking head and rolling eyes**

      “most traveling men would not want Barney Frank to pat them down at the airport security checkpoint,” LaBarbera said. “Neither would it be fair to assign Ellen DeGeneres to pat down female travelers.”

      Reply
      • 48. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 11:54 am

        I mean “REALLY!” now ?! How sexy can going through airport security be?

        “Perhaps some common-sense, healthy “discrimination” is in order: the TSA should put conditions on employment for self-acknowledged homosexuals — that they not be assigned to pat down travelers so as to avoid being put in sexually compromising situations;”

        att: Saturday Night Live! Peter LaBarbera has a great script for you!

        Reply
        • 49. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 11:59 am

          and

          “….In the same vein, the Army should no more force normal male soldiers to shower and bunk with homosexual male soldiers ”

          NORMAL male soldiers?

          Charming article.

          Reply
        • 50. Michael Adrian  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:55 pm

          Maybe gay security screeners should then pat down opposite sex travelers. Would that work out?

          I don’t understand the prevalent mindset that everything a gay person does is a sexual come-on.

          It cracked me up when the guy from SD said on CNN that the only people he wants ‘touching his junk” are his wife and maybe his doctor. I was raised Catholic in a liberal-minded but conservatively-behaved household and that level of prudishness astounds me. I’m guessing these people have never been to a rock concert or sports stadium, because I’ve been patted down there plenty of times.

          Reply
          • 51. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 1:08 pm

            Truly absurd. No doubt….no big deal at a game, a club….

            Personally, I think it would be simpler to get rid of segregated restrooms and showers…I think its the Perverted/Steroid/Macho/Straight males that cause female travelers not to want to be patted down by men….and why females are rightfully afraid for safety if restrooms / showers were integrated.

        • 52. Tomato  |  November 16, 2010 at 6:56 pm

          How incredibly over-sexed can the person possibly be who would even SUGGEST such a thing?

          Meanwhile, over here in the real world, random strangers one must touch as part of one’s job hold absolutely NO sexual appeal what-so-ever.

          Sheesh. What a pervert….
          I’d rather have a straight man pat my flabby dyke a$$ down than Mr. Closet Case Pervert any day!

          Reply
          • 53. Tomato  |  November 16, 2010 at 6:58 pm

            BTW, I was commenting on Peter “I go to gay sex scenes and take lots of pictures to slaver and drool over” LaBarbera’s oversexed and ridiculous statements.

      • 54. Ann S.  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:01 pm

        Ellen can pat me down any time, and I’m straight.

        She would at least be witty, respectful and reasonable about the silly security theater we all do at the airport.

        Reply
        • 55. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:13 pm

          Yay!!! Me too! probably would smell good too : D (Hi Ann!)

          Reply
    • 56. Alan E.  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:24 pm

      Most people going through airport security are probably not even attractive to the TSA workers.

      Reply
      • 57. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:39 pm

        LOLROTF – spot-on as usual Alan!

        Reply
        • 58. Tomato  |  November 16, 2010 at 8:39 pm

          Trust me, I have to touch people every single day in my line of work. It is not “attractive” at all.

          Reply
    • 59. JonT  |  November 16, 2010 at 3:07 pm

      Man, old Porno Pete is so scared of teh ghey.

      Perhaps some common-sense, healthy “discrimination” is in order…

      Uhm, how about ‘no’.

      “To allow homosexual agents to conduct same-gender pat-downs is tantamount to a new form of discrimination that must be recognized and prevented,”

      Huh? That article was funny on several levels. :)

      Reply
  • 60. Mike M  |  November 16, 2010 at 11:23 am

    So I suspect Newsweek allowed this article to be printed to generate controversy and bump readership. Clearly they want a slew of letters exposing NOM and Brian for what they really are. So I say give it to them. Don’t attack Brian personally though, talk about the NOM fail tour and how at nearly every stop the bigots were outnumbered. Talk about the bus covered in stock photos. Talk about how at every turn regular people and elected officials have come to rallies to support us. Make Brian and the Wicked Witch of the Bus exactly what they are, a non-issue. If you attack on personal grounds your efforts become just so much more yelling into the wind. If you make a reasoned argument detailing the places where they fail to make their point, you seem like the logical and best voice to be heard above the din.

    Reply
    • 61. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:47 pm

      @ Mike M
      I had similar thoughts today as I was eating lunch and pondering about article… another theory that came to mind is the person who wrote it is pro equality and wanted to bring awareness to Brian Brown’s existence…. who knows for sure…..

      What is the chance Brian Brown will take the stand in the upcoming Prop 8 trial? THAT would be illuminating to have Debois “interview” him!

      Reply
      • 62. Ann S.  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:49 pm

        @Gregory,

        No one will be taking the stand in the upcoming hearing. Appellate hearings are only for the lawyers to present oral arguments and for the judges to question them.

        Hugs,
        Ann

        Reply
        • 63. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 12:51 pm

          Thanks for clarification and education! I sincerely appreciate it! Looking forward to the hearing : )

          Reply
          • 64. Tomato  |  November 16, 2010 at 7:02 pm

            Open Invitation: Please join us Monday Dec 6 in a vigil outside. We’re working right now to get Unitarian and United Church of Christ congregations involved as well. If you belong to a faith group, please ask them to join us.

          • 65. Kathleen  |  November 16, 2010 at 7:29 pm

            Tomato, is there a way to get a hold of you? I’m on facebook (click my name). I’d like to give you my cell phone number so we can be sure to meet up on Dec 6.

          • 66. Tomato  |  November 16, 2010 at 8:46 pm

            Kathleen – I’m not on FB, but if you are active in the Bay Area you probably are on Billy B’s friends list. He’s the one we’re co-ordinating with, and he’ll be an awesome contact for you for info and such. Right now we’re ordering “Standing On The Side of Love” rally signs to hand out (a joint project of the UU and UUC churches) and trying to get ministers and other faith leaders to come Dec 6 in their clerical garb.

          • 67. Kathleen  |  November 16, 2010 at 8:51 pm

            I’m not in the Bay Area. I’m flying up there for the hearing. I’ll try to find you outside the courthouse.

          • 68. Alan E.  |  November 16, 2010 at 9:21 pm

            Do you know if I would be able to bring in a folded sign into the courthouse? I want to bring my signs with me for the outside, but I want to not have to get rid of them or lose them.

            Anyways, I’ll be there with my husband!

          • 69. Gregory in Salt Lake City  |  November 16, 2010 at 11:04 pm

            So glad you all will be attending (and reporting I hope!)

  • 70. rf  |  November 16, 2010 at 1:31 pm

    hey guys, wondering if anyone is following the protect marriage — one man one woman Facebook page. I think its the one that wasn’t part of NOM but then NOM took it over?

    something happened in the past two days (i’m part of a group that monitors anti-gay FB sites) and it seems they’re no longer deleting opposition comments.

    http://www.facebook.com/oneman.onewoman

    Here’s one post from the admin. but there are many examples of the new policy and seems a lot of NOMites are jumping ship:

    “I never delete anything. I’m the founder of this page, I delegated the administrative and moderating responsibilities in the past, but the sheriff is back in town.”

    Reply
    • 71. Ronnie  |  November 16, 2010 at 2:06 pm

      It is Louis….he is trying to weed out the extremists & the trolls…apparently some of the regulars aren’t too happy about the new addition of allowing opposition as long as they stick to the topic of marriage…..the same goes for those who are anti-Marriage Equality (they have to stick to marriage)….but it has been proven that they are not only anti-Marriage Equality but anti anything & everything that has to do do with being LGBT….one of that pages regulars posted this comment with a list of anti-gay pages:

      “Here is a last list of groups for those that are desiring to stay in a group that is Godly based and not politically, to go to.”

      (me) drama… : / …Ronnie

      Reply
    • 72. JonT  |  November 16, 2010 at 3:29 pm

      Interesting…

      The devil has really got ahold of this page. I don’t want any part of it. Bye.

      These people are so afraid of debate.

      The page is somewhat more interesting to read though :)

      Reply
      • 73. Tomato  |  November 16, 2010 at 7:05 pm

        Jesus confirmed a gay couple, and discussed how some are born gay and are the children of God as much as anyone else.
        http://www.wouldjesusdescriminate.org

        The “devil has got ahold of this page” person is clearly confused about what Jesus did vs. the devil.

        Reply
        • 74. JonT  |  November 16, 2010 at 7:22 pm

          Yes, and unfortunately, probably deliberately confused.

          Reply
  • 75. Bill  |  November 16, 2010 at 3:20 pm

    If any out there are following marriage equality in Australia these days, you’ll want to check this out. It’s heating up down under, too!!!

    It’s written by a ‘man of god,’ of course!

    http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/41134.html

    Reply
    • 76. JonT  |  November 16, 2010 at 4:01 pm

      Let’s think about it. If ‘equal love’ is the only prerequisite for marriage, then why not legalise marriage between uncles and nieces, or between mums and sons, if they are so inclined?

      I got this far before thinking: ‘Oh, this again‘. Didn’t read any further as I’ve already read this line of thinking many times already :)

      You’d think they could come up with better arguments someday. but I guess this is all they have.

      Reply
  • 77. Sagesse  |  November 16, 2010 at 3:23 pm

    This is not good.

    ‘Don’t ask, don’t tell’ splitting gay rights groups

    http://voices.washingtonpost.com/federal-eye/2010/11/dont_ask_dont_tell_splitting_g.html

    Reply
    • 78. Bob  |  November 16, 2010 at 10:08 pm

      definetly not good, actually very discouraging,,,, listed are seven orgainiztions fighting the battle to end DADT, each one asking for suppot and money, and know to further confuse supporters, we know have to decide which side of the split you want to support,

      Three willing to cut DADT from the spending bill, because they want the troops to be fully funded, I mean the gays, again putting their equality aside, to ensure those suppressing them can have the funds to continue doing so, Well I know they say it nicer than that, but get a grip, there was a service member on here a few weeks ago who said, they are well used to the habit of hording supplies to endure the lean times while the Defense Authorization Bill is hammered out, on the ground they see it as a shortage of supplies like toilet paper, and such just to make them feel threatened that they’ll be in troulbe if the budget is not passed. They are prepared for thes antics,

      What I have a hard time wrapping my head around is the 7 orgainzations, my god , no wonder we’re losing, there’s seven organizations making money off this oppresiion……

      Now look at the other side, all the religios groups (just talked about earlier you know them all ) put there differences aside and found one common goal, and created NOM the front runner, through wihich they all channel the money, I’d say they have it right,

      Why can’t we learn from that, follow the money, ours goes in seven different directions, and that is just on the DADT issue,,,,, then just start to wrap your minds around all the other organizations, around each of the other laws that have been enacted to oppress us. We as LGBT community have gosh, I don’t know but just try and figure how many places asking for our money, to help our cause.

      Talk about split, I learned a lot from Alan’s fast, so many organizations were opposed to his action, one which was supposed to be a movement from one person, it channeled energy away from DADT, And the real intersting thing was his movement was from the ground building out, but one of his reasons for ending it was lack of funding, I’m confused about that, That is a contradiction,

      You bet like Fiona says about the Mormons , follow the money, it’s a little difficult because of the new laws re polictical funding,

      But at least for them they have one organization getting the money, how many Brian Browns do we give our money to, at least seven, and they don’t agree on how to best help us.,

      The LGBT community better get a grip, and find one focus. (I kinda think Alan had it) and I wish he would find a way to take it further cause he was onto something ….

      Reply
  • 79. Sagesse  |  November 16, 2010 at 3:31 pm

    This is better.

    Lieberman, Collins seek earlier release of Pentagon ‘don’t ask, don’t tell’ report

    http://www.politico.com/blogs/joshgerstein/1110/Lieberman_Collins_seek_earlier_release_of_Pentagon_dont_ask_dont_tell_report.html

    Reply
  • 80. Sagesse  |  November 16, 2010 at 3:51 pm

    Rachel Maddow on John McCain

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32545640

    Reply
  • 83. Sagesse  |  November 16, 2010 at 4:05 pm

    John McCain, the Jon Stewart version

    http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-november-15-2010/it-gets-worse-psa

    Reply
  • 84. sweetleopardess  |  November 17, 2010 at 11:30 am

    When I read this story it made me want to barf. I emailed a letter to the Editor at Newsweek, and in it I asked them how much NOM had paid them to write this editorial. I guess Newsweek is so desperate for money, they’ll take it from anyone! (PS I know they didn’t actually get paid, but what on earth possessed them to write such drivel?)

    Reply

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